Message from @Miniature Menace

Discord ID: 607813011633078285


2019-08-05 05:46:14 UTC  

its transitional

2019-08-05 05:46:28 UTC  

well, apparently they weren't, because giraffes exist

2019-08-05 05:46:50 UTC  

and other than giraffes, we actually have examples of organisms where we can link certain adaptations to gene replication errors

2019-08-05 05:47:00 UTC  

such as in frogs

2019-08-05 05:47:03 UTC  

and even in humans

2019-08-05 05:47:03 UTC  

Cars exist too, but it's not correct to say that since they exist they must grow on trees.

2019-08-05 05:47:46 UTC  

we have evidence which demonstrates a link between *other* complex traits and evolutionary mutational processes, it's not difficult to infer that this is probably the same with giraffes as well

2019-08-05 05:48:22 UTC  

what's funny, is that at first I thought you were trolling

2019-08-05 05:48:33 UTC  

maybe investigate Ring Species

2019-08-05 05:48:56 UTC  

they're an example of these processes in action, resulting in the gradual speciation of organisms

2019-08-05 05:49:16 UTC  

there's also evidence of this in dog breeds, as well as in fruit flies

2019-08-05 05:49:43 UTC  

where the reproductive isolation necessary for speciation can be shown to occur gradually

2019-08-05 05:49:52 UTC  

But have you made a mosquito out of fruit flies?

2019-08-05 05:50:53 UTC  

they have made fruit flies which experience reproductive isolation from other fruit flies, which descended from common ancestors, while still being able to breed with other fruit flies along their selective strain

2019-08-05 05:51:00 UTC  

which is a factor in speciation

2019-08-05 05:51:08 UTC  

perhaps one of the most important factors

2019-08-05 05:51:22 UTC  

Is it reproducible anywhere else?

2019-08-05 05:51:23 UTC  

and some dogs breed notoriously poorly with other specific breeds

2019-08-05 05:51:40 UTC  

there's examples of this in nature, with the aforementioned Ring Species

2019-08-05 05:51:54 UTC  

without the involvement of human experimentation

2019-08-05 05:52:39 UTC  

Basically, if an organism from a common ancestor experiences a long enough period of reproductive isolation from other strains, it can eventually become reproductively incompatible

2019-08-05 05:53:34 UTC  

Hell, lions and tigers have a graduated interfertility with one another. But are recognized as different species.

2019-08-05 05:53:50 UTC  

It's funny how I bring up unique and completely vital features of biology that are not found in any other species and your response is "Hey let's look at its ASS"

2019-08-05 05:54:32 UTC  

Well, evolution is ultimately about reproduction.

2019-08-05 05:54:45 UTC  

What traits are transmitted, and what traits are isolated.

2019-08-05 05:54:53 UTC  

What gets extinguished.

2019-08-05 05:54:57 UTC  

The okapis didn't have giraffe-sized hearts.

2019-08-05 05:56:41 UTC  

The change in cardiovascular system would need to correspond with changes in the physiological demands of it, yes.

2019-08-05 05:56:47 UTC  

It seems really unlikely that an okapi would not only spontaeously give birth to a giraffe, but that the genes would be stable enough to make more giraffes without a giraffe mate.

2019-08-05 05:57:29 UTC  

Dismissing the possibility because these changes are necessary, and that seems too dramatic, ignores how often subtle and gradual these changes really are, and really need to be.

2019-08-05 05:58:29 UTC  

TFW apparently okapi can't give a birth to okapi with a 2cm longer neck giving it an advantage at the buffet and making it popular with all the okapi ladies, thus securing more long boi okapis in the next generation

2019-08-05 05:58:50 UTC  

An Okapi wouldn't give birth to a giraffe, but an transitional organism between an Okapi and a giraffe, very much more resembling an Okapi, and being likely reproductively compatible with other Okapi, with which it would reproduce

2019-08-05 05:58:55 UTC  

In conclusion, long neck okapis are chads

2019-08-05 05:59:38 UTC  

All the biological features that make the giraffe unique are inter- and co-dependent. It needs to not only have the right vascular system, but the right growth patterns and the right leg hide thickness so it won't bleed out if injured.

2019-08-05 05:59:52 UTC  

The comparative rate of reproduction, and the familial isolation of these new characteristics would result in gradual change, and an eventual phenotypical and genetic departure from the root species

2019-08-05 06:00:08 UTC  

We don't have long-necked okapis, we have 30-foot tall giraffes and no intermediary forms to suggest a 10 and 20-foot intermediary.

2019-08-05 06:00:58 UTC  

because these intermediate forms aren't static, nor are they impervious to extinction

2019-08-05 06:01:10 UTC  

Your evidence doesn't exist.

2019-08-05 06:01:22 UTC  

It doesn't need to, we got giraffes