Message from @Rusty

Discord ID: 641108729277710336


2019-11-05 02:51:42 UTC  

So it's OK to be religious but you could be jailed for being irreligious?

2019-11-05 02:52:03 UTC  

The evangelocon argument to bringing Christian rules to court houses.

2019-11-05 02:52:21 UTC  

Basically, free to be Christian, but no freedom to be not Christian.

2019-11-05 02:52:46 UTC  

1st A protects especially freedom **FROM** religion, mind you.

2019-11-05 02:53:22 UTC  

*"**Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion**, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."*

2019-11-05 02:53:58 UTC  

1st A specifically prohibits theocracy, ensures right of disbelief in particular religion (whether atheist or member of another religion).

2019-11-05 02:54:10 UTC  

1st A is especially and only freedom **FROM** religion, not freedom of.

2019-11-05 02:54:30 UTC  

It does not say you are free to do animal sacrifice or human sacrifice or other freedom **OF** religion.

2019-11-05 02:54:37 UTC  

Not at all. I'm saying that the current liberal atheist position is inherited from European Continental thought and not related to the 1st.

2019-11-05 02:54:54 UTC  

It states that the government cannot impose a religion.

2019-11-05 02:55:16 UTC  

I'm sorry but the latter is also the basisi of US position on religious freedom.

2019-11-05 02:55:24 UTC  

It is freedom from enforcement of state religion.

2019-11-05 02:55:31 UTC  

It's freedom **FROM** religion.

2019-11-05 02:55:52 UTC  

Not even state merely federal. By the 10th.

2019-11-05 02:56:11 UTC  

It does not state "you are free to practice religion". it says "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion".

2019-11-05 02:56:35 UTC  

**or preventing the exercise thereof**

2019-11-05 02:56:57 UTC  

Oh. That part. So it's both freedom from and of.

2019-11-05 02:57:02 UTC  

Yep

2019-11-05 02:57:03 UTC  

But it does include "from" as well.

2019-11-05 02:57:09 UTC  

You cannot say it's only "of".

2019-11-05 02:57:12 UTC  

It goes all ways

2019-11-05 02:57:29 UTC  

Many Christian conservatives think it's only freedom "of" but not at all "from".

2019-11-05 02:57:51 UTC  

They use that as an argument for unconstitutional laws that prohibit atheists from running for any state office.

2019-11-05 02:58:28 UTC  

An interesting experiment is comparing the Alexa ranks of Sam Harris's website to the alexa rank of Atheist movement organizations. Basically, it seems like half the atheist movement transitioned into the SJW movement as Scott Alexander points out, but also that the other half of the atheist movement moved to outlets like Quillette, SamHarris.org, Joe Rogan Experience, AiU, etc.

2019-11-05 02:59:31 UTC  

Yeah, because the non-SJW atheism didn't exist. It was split up to individuals who opposed SJWs.

2019-11-05 02:59:45 UTC  

Every single atheist **institution** in USA was pro-SJW.

2019-11-05 03:00:23 UTC  

That's because they made the mistake of thinking *everything* in conservativism was wrong.

2019-11-05 03:00:35 UTC  

And there's undoubtedly something good with it.

2019-11-05 03:00:51 UTC  

This is a misunderstanding of the state and federal. The constitution sets limits on **federal** power. Not the state or local or sovereign. This is clearly stated in the 9th and 10th.

2019-11-05 03:01:16 UTC  

Both economically and in the pro-family thinking (although even conservatives twist it into being just anti-gay, rather than actually focusing on keeping heterosexual families intact).

2019-11-05 03:01:28 UTC  

Atheist movement committed pretty much suicide.

2019-11-05 03:02:14 UTC  

@Jym So individual states can prohibit 1st and 2nd A?

2019-11-05 03:04:06 UTC  

This is again a misunderstanding. Where there is a federal mandate or constituent power that law is supreme.

2019-11-05 03:04:32 UTC  

If constitution only restricts the Federation but not the states, how do 5th A apply?

2019-11-05 03:04:57 UTC  

I mean, FBI **DIDN'T EVEN EXIST** originally, so 5th A would not apply to anyone at all! For fucks sake.

2019-11-05 03:05:19 UTC  

If FBI doesn't exist, there's no Federal police, and 5th A is meaningless.

2019-11-05 03:05:42 UTC  

Why was 5th A even passed if there's no federal power that it is affected by?

2019-11-05 03:07:02 UTC  

Again, where the fed has a delegated power it is supreme over the state. So all those civil rights override any local ordinance. But those powers *not specifically delegated to the fed* are free to local interpretation.

2019-11-05 03:08:54 UTC  

Well, I think 1st A overrides any local law to prohibit an atheist for running for an office.

2019-11-05 03:09:01 UTC  

And SCOTUS is on my side.

2019-11-05 03:09:24 UTC  

Because there are such laws, and they've consistently ruled unconstitutional.