@NAME_ You should spend some time trying to understand their point of view. They think it is wrong to "force" the woman to have the child if she doesn't want to. They see it as immoral to let things follow their natural course because to them it is a question of bodily autonomy.

But they have a lot of more misguided moralizations

Including wanting consequence-free sex

Uh NodeSpaghetti let me tell you something

I think they're deplorable, but they think they are moral and I am the deplorable one... so it is important to understand them, so there can be a middle ground from which to make a movement.

You do that a lot in America, here you avoid to go further. like there is no need for it to be a reason that it extends till there. they believe women shouldnt be forced ( like there is no situations leading there )

Eh?

The thing with the left is that they love to push their abortion arguments as a matter of "rights". What they really want is to get off consequence free with sex, when it is clearly visible that the fetus especially in late stage is a living being.

That doesn't make sense

You guys are missing the point. That's clear *to you*. It's clear *to them* that you hate women and want to take their rights away.

You do that with religion, even tho Jesus accepted slaves, women, and other minorities, now the mainstream idea is that we should respect islam, even tho we know what it stands for. Yet in America, the common sense about it is that theyre both religions, so they must be equal.

Yes i agree with you in the goal of achieving a middle ground thats important. im talking about something else

Islam, what an outdated religion.

I really don't understand the meaning of your sentences

I can say this confidently as a gay man, FUCK Islam.

I am sort of a moderate/secular Christian

What im saying is. in America you avoid to look at the true picture

@ReneAensland I have a feeling you would like David Wood's takes on Islam

You try to look at the "big picture "

The big picture isn't the true picture?

*delurks* It's the old "Misguided, not evil" argument. The thing is, misguided people do terrible things at a high cost as much as evil people. Being stupid doesn't justify their actions.

@NodeSpaghetti Got the cliff notes?

I am not a hardcore ultra-religious Christian but I do hold their values and believe in God

And do you mean "you" in general or me specifically?

Even though I'm wearing a blasphemous hat in my picture, I consider myself Christian.

@ReneAensland he uses Islamic sources to point out how messed up Islam is.

I was baptized Christian as well.

Does it matter if someone murders another person because they enjoy it, ot because the space hamsters told them to? The victim is still dead.

Honestly I am with Spaghetti on this one I think we need to look at the other point of view

Yeah David Wood is a Christian who makes lota of videos exposing Islam's weird and horrible bits

@NodeSpaghetti Yeah, that religion would kill people like me by burning me alive, throwing me off a roof, getting stoned to death or just decapitated.

No, as I said, for example you say, " she wants to not be forced to have the baby" as if there isn't a situation called s** leading there

@AWOIII 💯

The motive may change the punishment, but the crime is the same.

@NAME_ I agree with you, but I don't think your way of talking about this is pragmatic

I am someone who is suprisingly rare to find, a pro-life libertarian.

Believing abortion is a "right" doesn't take away the fact that they're killing a living creature.

^^

Well yeah maybe I mixed conservative views with my talking points

@ReneAensland yeah, or do the same just for having a beer and bacon sandwich for lunch!

I support lgbt rights but not abortion