Stalin would have had them shot for being social fascists.

Communists want the complete subservience of every facet of life to the state in practice, and the complete destruction of the state in theory. I wouldn't compare Labour to Marx ay day of the week.

That’s exactly what the Labour Party want.

the labor party literaly wants to do what stalin did!!

But they are a political organisation so they do what they realistically can from where they are.

Labour is pretty broad. I'm sure there are hardliners, but no, I wouldn't say party politics is Stalinist in nature. That would be a big laugh.

Because you are conflating communism with Stalinism, which is disingenuous.

"Communists want the complete subservience of every facet of life to the state in practice, and the complete destruction of the state in theory."
"That’s exactly what the Labour Party want."

Yes, that’s what I said. That’s not necessarily Stalinism.

Marxism-Leninism is exactly that, which is often conflated with Stalinism for very good reason.

So no it's not really disingenuous.

Right. Well either way they are communists. They sing the commie songs and do the commie things, and aim for that as a communist end. So they are communists.

Hold on, Markov said something very relevant to this. Let me find it.

"When Western revolutionaries shout about radical change in the world and a happy future life under socialism or Communism, we want to tell them: 'Come join us, under the lid; come live your happy life here!' They do not know the meaning of the words they mouth and they become intoxicated by their infantile fantasies. We know the meaning. We have paid the highest price to learn it."

Of course they don’t think of it in the terms of “total subservience to the state”. They put it in terms of “ending institutional oppression” or whatever Marxist word stew they have cooked up this week. But they are communists.

Democratic Socialists are just fucking LARPers. They like to sing the commie songs and do the commie things, but they aren't communists.

uhhhhh Marx was totally against his own contemporary version of the liberal shitshow in Western countries today. He viewed social justice as we know it as a diversion from proletariat struggle.

Just because Peterson calls it Marxist doesn't mean it's Marxist. He likes to jump Foucault and Marx together pretty moronically.

Right. Well either way, regardless of what arguments you want to have about the correct use of the term “communist”, in the U.K. the state ideology is hard left.

They're just rat politicians who will virtue signal to get votes. It's the same everywhere, whatever party. Nobody has ideals.

Career politicians are fucking scum. Everybody knows that.

Like promising higher minimum wage. It would take 5 minutes max to explain to someone with a functional IQ of 20 why that's a terrible idea, but people fall for that shit and people use it on their political platforms.

And right now the "hard left" is pandering to the chic social justice narrative.

Which means channeling pseudo-Marxist rhetoric.

Do you live in the U.K.?

I’ll interpret that silence as a no.

Multitasking, but you're correct.

It’s not “pandering” as you so delicately put it. The state ideology is constantly propagandised and is basically inescapable.

In the U.K, the extreme majority of people watch state television and listen to state radio for at least an hour or so a day, if not constantly.

In my extremely uneducated and inexperienced collection of what's going on in the UK the "state ideology" is rejected by most and is not a majority position.

I mean, if you want to get snippy about 1984 references based on some nitpicking about what’s tr00 communism and what’s not, fine, but if you think that the U.K. is just “pandering” to a social justice narrative instead of imprisoning people about it then you just have no idea what’s going on.

I think it's pandering in its most extreme form.

That’s deeply naive.

I'm sorry you feel that way.

It’s not a malicious criticism. The people in charge of the U.K. are on board with hard left ideology that says that anyone who walks on the magic dirt of Britain will become one of their new Muslim cake-bakers that upholds “British Values”. They are all extreme liberal left and versed in Marx and the extreme phobia and suppression of any dissent is not a ‘career politician’ thing but an ideological thing.

Tony Blair said there was nothing worse than intolerance and exclusivity, and all other prime ministers since then have agreed with this.

For sure there's a lot of ideology involved at this point. But how do you think this shit starts? It's just another example of why democracy is fucked.

It’s the Jews

You think Trump is actually an ideologue? He's wishy washy on all of his fucking positions.

But he still riles people up.

Just pandering for votes.