Message from @Bookworm

Discord ID: 536403311662858241


2019-01-20 04:27:25 UTC  

If you can't see any difference in the product from person to person then it is not expressing anything distinct

2019-01-20 04:27:55 UTC  

And yet porn is still protected under free speech laws.

2019-01-20 04:28:01 UTC  

There is no justice.

2019-01-20 04:28:24 UTC  

The seller of a burger has already agreed to "express" their sale of a burger. A custom cake baker did not consent to the expression of nazi propaganda if someone asks for that kind of cake.

2019-01-20 04:29:23 UTC  

Actually nix that luxury goods line

2019-01-20 04:29:31 UTC  

The issue is that the seller is has not previously consented to express all messages that may come from a custom cake request, but a seller of a burger has consented to the singular expression of the sale of a burger.

2019-01-20 04:30:20 UTC  

The main issue with protecting artistic expression is that the lines are far too gray with it

2019-01-20 04:31:52 UTC  

So, what if someone only agrees to sell to the people they feel like?

2019-01-20 04:32:12 UTC  

Would that not be an acceptable contract?

2019-01-20 04:32:48 UTC  

Then were back at denying requests based on political alignment

2019-01-20 04:33:18 UTC  

No, cause the delineation of why they are selling to some people has to be based on the product itself

2019-01-20 04:33:27 UTC  

It's not about the expression being artistic in nature. It's about the established rules for what a seller has consented to sell. A black artist could be selling paintings of his dog and shouldn't be able to refuse selling to anyone. He has consented to the sale of paintings of his dog. If that same black artist says they will sell paintings of customers dogs, and a customer sends a picture of a dog with "I HATE NIGGERS" shaved into his back, he can refuse that service because he did not consent to painting that previously.

2019-01-20 04:33:40 UTC  

So it has nothing to do with agreement.

2019-01-20 04:33:55 UTC  

It has to do with the agreement of sale of the product.

2019-01-20 04:34:01 UTC  

Not the people

2019-01-20 04:34:10 UTC  

Well, apparently the seller isn't allowed to stipulate who they sell to.

2019-01-20 04:34:19 UTC  

You have to sell to everyone who has the money to buy, or else.

2019-01-20 04:34:24 UTC  

You are not listening to me.

2019-01-20 04:34:42 UTC  

Unless they have a better reason than "i dont like that person"

2019-01-20 04:34:43 UTC  

What about that statement is inaccurate to what you're saying?

2019-01-20 04:35:15 UTC  

You say "You have to sell your product to everyone who wants to buy it, unless it's a unique artistic expression".

2019-01-20 04:35:48 UTC  

Or you have a concrete reason for not selling the products yes

2019-01-20 04:35:56 UTC  

Not that statement, but the 2 before. "Would that not be an acceptable contract?" No the stipulations I'm making are about the product. "So it has nothing to do with the agreement?" No, it has to do with the agreement about the product being produced itself.

2019-01-20 04:36:09 UTC  

things along the lines of lacking inventory or time

2019-01-20 04:36:10 UTC  

So you can force someone to do business when they don't want to.

2019-01-20 04:36:28 UTC  

or having the validity of payment be in question

2019-01-20 04:36:34 UTC  

Yes thats how it works

2019-01-20 04:36:42 UTC  

They have to have a good reason why not.

2019-01-20 04:36:52 UTC  

Who decides what a good reason is?

2019-01-20 04:37:03 UTC  

The American government? That's a fine decision making body, innit?

2019-01-20 04:37:46 UTC  

We're talking about principles. I've already showed you what constitutes a good reason

2019-01-20 04:38:09 UTC  

Better than corporations\

2019-01-20 04:39:18 UTC  

Right, and your principle is, the person who sells goods doesn't get to decide who to sell their products to based off their desires.

2019-01-20 04:39:30 UTC  

Why?

2019-01-20 04:40:36 UTC  

Because companies should not concern themselves with what their customers believe or do in their private lives

2019-01-20 04:41:33 UTC  

The root of that is because of the danger of businesses blocking people out of their services due to arbitrary characteristics. If you are a Right Winger and go to a left wing area that has the ability to deny service arbitrarily, you can be blocked from using anything in the area. They would effectively force you out of town through their market power.

2019-01-20 04:41:39 UTC  

People shouldn't care about what other people do?

2019-01-20 04:42:41 UTC  

Do you think Walmart is allowed to deny service to black people in your AnCap utopia? If you think so then we've arrived at the final thread of the discussion. We probably won't get anything else useful in this line of thought if we disagree on that.

2019-01-20 04:43:26 UTC  

Companies should not concern themselves with what their customers do because that would require companies to be aware of their customer's private lives

2019-01-20 04:43:35 UTC  

Being black is not an action

2019-01-20 04:44:46 UTC  

So, people have a right to services?