Somedudewithaname (Discord ID: 470283334531022850), page 1
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Your telling me how you feel but i don't really care
so I think it's fair enough that we give them special attention when they need or request it.
BUt i think it's a loaded question
I think anyone whoo needs special attention should get it.
Okay so, I for one am of the opinion that transgenderism is a result of biological and social pressures
which one is more important? I'm not sure the jury is still out on that.
BUt becuase of body dysmorphia being caused by external factors to the person's own cohices, I belieive it is fair for them to get special treatment.
I mean how much would your sex matter to you as a person if you lived outside of a society?
I really don't have the answer to that question.
Ugh and when speaking about biolgical sex its not so clear cut
we have priamry and secondary sexual characteristics
the XY XX dichotmy is punctuated by alterations in that chromosome set
Where would these people fall in?
It's an exception but exceptions raise problems in categorization
What makes you primarily a mna then?
Is it your biology or your mental state?
Are we speaking priamrily about biology here?
Your peception on what makes you a man might differ from his.
before we go on lets define terms?
WE use Male and Female to refer to biolgocial gender
and Man and WOman to refer to gender
I mean male and female to refer to biological sex
are you fine with this distinction?
I know a lot of trans people feel that ay
Of course there are trans exclusioinary radical feminists out there
but many feminists also support trans issue
which now we've moved on from the biological issue into the domain of sociology
His experience will not be universal and wll vary.
From the deep south to new york city
but it doesnt mean we can help with both
which one matters more is a different question though
Okay ican agree with you their is a substantial difference
It's really hard from an experimental standpoint to isolate mental processes from biology and sociological phenomenom.
Why do men think different in the way do?
Why are some men terrible at math while women are better?
Prehaps it's because females are taught to be more in touch withtheir emotions
and I don't see a lack of emotion as a positive or even rational thing
They went through their formative years though
things have changed dramitically
I'm sorry but how does this relate back to the original topic of transgederism?
wait keep going i see where your going
that's an interesting way to put it
The difference I would see there is transgeder people do face simmilar discrimination to women
If you look at studies after they transition they face simmilar harrasement as women
And there is a level of solidarity between diffrent "opressed groups"
you have the same experiences, or simmilar experiences to a woman
Frito can I detour for this dude?
I'll add you as a freind and we can continue later?
Well I guess I'll take issue with the idea that you must fit a group perfectly to bit part of the group. The experience of a group as broad as woman varies amongst different races classes and etc. You'd have to deconstruct the meaning of the idea of women and tell me what specifcally about the trans woman experiences disqualifies them from this group.
Yes but you are a minority population
and your experiences are closer to there's than the average white persons
you can have some degree of solidarity with any woman
Also we're erecting the categories artificlly in the first place
Again your acting like the average experience of black man is universal
They'll all be different for a number of factors
I had an african freind in high school and he'd always hang around us indian kids becayse he identifed with ys more
I mean it's a universal experience
but not all experiences are universal
Yes but now we're defining categories with arbitrary cut offs
and you can talk about averages but trans people are a very small minority
It would vary greatly on the population you find them in
but if you look at african immigrants in america
they are one of the most sucesfull group
there graduate education rate is insane
your creating these categories now.
It's like 10%hold a phd that's impressive for any demographic in america
But your arguemtn is trans people can't idenitfy as women cause they don't have the same set of experiences?
There are a lot of things that trans people go through.
Idk being told your idntiy is wrong is an issue
they'll bully you for anything
you really think they'd go easy on a trans kid>
and they went so hard on this kid who came out of the closet
We can't argue from annedote though
all I know is studies show that transgenders who transition have better mental health than those who don't.
And for my concern, that's the most important issue.
You can't prove it's because of a biolgical or social class without chaninging the second varaible
Why is the sucide rate so high?
For simmilar reasons to that of transgenders who don't transition
I haven't read studies on that one
they're a book called transgednerism and the brain i reccomend reading
Frido i;ll agree with you on that
but the issue is society doesn't view these things in that way.
ANd for some people body dismprphia is the issue.
You know ill agree with you that gender roles need be deconstructed
and if women and men felt like they could do as they please we'd have no issue
but some men find they identify as women
It could be you feel like you idenitfy more with the social identity of a woman
they're experience as a woman will be different from other woman
but these categroies are arbitrary at best and what one choses to identify as is not really that big of an issue
if it helps them, if it's what they want to do, why stop them?
Gender is a social construct at best.
And some men do posses feminized brains.
Okay, but what about men with feminizied brains?
Why can't they identify as a woman?
I'm sorry who has there mike on?
Are you advocaing for removing these things?
Okay well....I think we're getting into more philsophical disagreements there
Some people do things for fun.
Some people do things to feel like they have an idenity.
Ooof my brain is a bit fried from the lab forgive me
It makes you feel like you belongg better.
And yes it has no ecomomic benefit
but personal welness i take to be a benefit in and of itslef
Well maybe if you do that you may have some issues
but again, men can have feminized brains
and with feminized brains they can still function and contribute
they can do all the things we do
Your making the comparison between transgederism and transspecisim
as if the latter is at all plausible
Maybe some people are willing to take that risk.
ANd prehaps society can do a better job with helping them navigate a difficult process and journey.
If we we're more accepting prehpas the rate wouldn't be so high.
Again, your acting and assuming what the best intrest of these people are.
As if you and I know what's best for them.
Make discrimination illegal, social dafety nets, and generally people being kinder and more tolerant would all help
WHat's so wrong with helpnig each other?
You know im not just advocating for minorities only to be trewated better
i want everyone to be treated better
but minorities get it the worse
so im priorityzing there treatment
I think you deserve equal attention to everyone else
equal attention and treatment of needs is easier than ever
it'll be idelogical issues that'll prevent us from equality, not technology
SO your advocating for collective ownership of the means of production? 😃
I think you can help people outside of your in group, but it takes patenice education love and time.
Just like anything that's worth fighting for.
We live in a society, my actions will effect you.
So lets go back to our world where we are an interconnected interdependent species
lets hear about the decay of western civlization because of the gays
What issue does the shift in acceptable range of ideas provides/
Also why does family stability matter more?
Your talking about your feelings man
I don't care if people get divorced if it's the right thing for them.
I don't care if family units break down.
Hell family unit structure is different across societies
chinese cultures calue extedned family while americand focus on the nucleus
Good luck with maintaining that.
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