@shinjitsu (Discord ID: 250054875583479810), page 1
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he wasn't talking about recently he was talking about a long time ago
LOL israel was for the 2 state propositions
lol the jews just lovvved the UN partition plan
this kikeish fucking circular reasoning
nukes created by einstein lmlfao
imagine being so literally autistic you say einstein is responsible for nukes
nick is absolutely destroying this kid
he has said nothing other than 'that's debunked'
Nope brainlet tier
Imagine believing in a God and thinking he created shit tier people knowingly
Doesn't get more autistic than that
Like broseph said all predestination is a retarded attempt at reconciling free will with an omniscient God
Do you even know what Calvinism is lmao
So why would he create shit tier people then
Lmao solid argument
If you're autistic
Happens when someone just used "uh I'm not God" as an actual argument
Or I don't have a positive assertion to a God I should say
>can't defend Calvinism going beyond 1 layer deep
You realize any ideology that you differ with could use the exact same argument you have. I could argue for gods existence far better than you because I have read these religious texts
So no argument for Calvinism?
Yeah of course
You're making a conclusion that requires a jump from there that you're not justifying though
Let's say yes completely given agency for the sake of the argument
Wait hold up I wanna hear his reasoning
In Calvinism *yes*
This is my problem with what you're saying
In Calvinism it 100% is the fault of God that people do these things. Both collectivizing and being individually immoral
It's why I don't like Calvinism
No they shouldn't be because predestination is wrong, Calvinism is based on predestination and that is that
By extension it's wrong
No you can't have both
Sure but you can't make any claim that's not the same as a contradicting
You're talking about 2 things were consider that are mutually exclusive
Larp you need to look up what predestination is.
Okay sure a plan but that's not what you said originally Thomas
Predestination is the idea that some people all people are created and it is predestined whether or not they will ascend. This is 100% in contradiction with free will
Intent isn't what predestination says
You can't just use the word in a different sense
Predestination says the destination of the soul is predetermined.
As in you either ascend to heaven or don't.
Yeah I agree with you when we talk about intent 100%
We were originally talking about Calvinism though that's where the discussion sprang up
Yeah Simon that's the thing though you are saying free will doesn't exist if it's predetermined whether or not they will go to heaven. Either that or they can do ANYTHING they want in life and still ascend
IQ is both but this is irrelevant
Predetermined is fine
It's only to a degree though
I highly suggest you read the gay science. He goes into everything we're talking about much better than j can
Okay you could argue that but no Christians will agree with you
I tend to believe that but for the sake of the argument we assumed agency is real
I'm not saying we can or have to know
I'm saying if you believe in Calvinism you believe that either free will doesn't exist, or that people who are going to be going to heaven can do whatever immoral thin they want and still get in
No they can't
Calvinism believes that a soul is destined for heaven or hell determined at or prior to birth
meaning you either believe
1: Free will does not exist and this person will not be immoral.
2: It does not matter if this person is immoral in life, free will can exist, but they will do whatever they want and still get in.
What you will try to do now is say that it's number 1 but the character traits of the individual are the ones that determine how they act but you can't do this
It means that you can though
and if you can there is no way to say that this person is predestined for heaven or hell
unless the person's actions don't matter
These are non-arguments
You can't say that and still have free will
because it is determined *prior to their actions* whether or not they go to heaven
This is just logically false
you can not give free will while remaining omniscient
Because if it is known what you will do, then it is predetermined what you will do, and you have no agency
no you are just flat out wrong here there isn't even an argument to make.
No that's wrong. This is accepted by wrong by every philosopher even religious ones
No it doesn't matter. If he **knows** what actions you will tkae prior to you making them. Then there is **no** way to say you could have chosen otherwise.
This is not up for debate, this is widely accepted as problem by people you probably agree with
In this scenario free will is an illusion
It's why Calvinism (specifically predestination) is wrong and where these disagreements come from
*possible actions* is not the same as saying knowing which actions the person will take
Prior to you making them?
Just yes or no prior to you making them, does God know what decision you will make? In your opinion
because the soul is predestined to heaven or hell
Yes or no, does God know what action you will make before you make it?
This is literally the central tenant of Calvinism
This is what you think
Specifically here though, if God knows what action will be taken, free will doesn't exist.
And then calvinism is fine and a working theory
He doesn't have to bne
if the decision is predetermined, then you don't have free will.
Again this is something everyone has agreed on for hundred and hundreds of years
Because if one has free will there is no set decision yet....
Yeah it's an appeal to majority when you disregard the most fundamental and obvious logic that exists.
Yup because to say a decision is known before it's made with 100% certainty directly implies that it is predetermined, and not decided by free will.
Nichomachean ethics and Kants critiques are the best
As long as you either say no free will or no predestination
Oh oops it is way I read that a while back
I wasn't a fan of the exposition half where he explained the history of it
Yeah I read that one way back when I didn't care much for history
Yeah same. I really gotta brush up on my history of the Middle East and Europe though
Just picked up that book Against our better judgement
My most recent anime was a pretty gay one but it was good. Your lie in April
The contraceptive stat is ridiculous to use
You don't get to use contraception for your numbers
Abortion helps whites demographically
Abortive contraceptive is an oxymoron
Oh yeah I count that as just abortion
I thought you were talking about condoms
Abortions are massively over representative of blacks
I'm not arguing that abortion is okay. I'm arguing the replacement thing you said. It's just completely wrong
You're counting only the white abortions
So what abortion affects other races more than whites
Without it demographics would be worse
This is objectively true, and doesn't mean abortion is fine
But the fact remains it's technically helping (to what degree I have no idea) demographics
There would be more black babies too lmfao
If abortion was illegal it would be illegal for all
Saying they wouldn't keep getting pregnant is a retarded assumption that you're basing off nothing
You think they're getting abortions like 3 times a year? No
We have around 800k abortions ever hear in the US and around half are blacks
Yeah cause that's stopped them in the past
And who says they are averaging 5 abortions
Can you Give any numbers or do you just guess and make things up
You are just objectively wrong if abortion was illegal it would make a lower demographics of whites
How do you know whites wouldn't have less sex and less kids?
No we have all sorts of safety nets
And make assumptions you can't justify then change the topic
You can't say to what degree this would play out
Holy fuck you are literally retarded
You are telling me blacks, the people who leave heir kids 70% of the time would stop fucking each other and making babies when they get on welfare because abortion isn't legal?
No you are so wrong it's not even funny
Are you joking or are you actually this stupid
Because there weren't fucking mountains of money they could count on from entitlement programs for having kids
I'm not sure how you've been talking for 15 minutes and haven't given a single figure
If we cut all abortion the black % of population would go up over time as a direct result
Why do you think that blacks would stop being impregnated while whites wouldn't
You're comparing society over a span of 6 decades
If you think this is a valid comparison that's just embarassing g
You think blacks would stop fucking without condoms? If abortions were illegal?
Because they're not getting abortions more than once every 9 months that's so stupid to think
We are comparing he people who would already be getting abortions and you're talking about white people broadly lmfao
Problem when you have literally 85 IQ takes and can't follow your own argument to its logical conclusion
Yeah let me know when you're gonna be able to get rid of abortion and simultaneously the welfare state
Obviously it's contributed to the loss of traditional family
If you read on a kindle I heard your IQ is 8 points lower
Legit came here because I saw your lie in April text
When she said lost motivation I had assumed she was most of the way through
Yeah I agree if you know from the beginning no point. Rip
I'm outside Boston. I'm sure they're bad in there
Wow this memo looks really bad for the Russia investigation
Running arpaio would be one of the dumbest ideas ever
I'm gonna throw some money in predictit on him losing
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