I can see why it happens, and i know a place in eu madd heroin legal and gave out free shots for then

if you have never met or talked to a herion addict, you are proba bly lucky, but its hard to quantify

So it depends

Netherlands? Don't have legal everything?

I think so

They have those shoot up clinics

so my mom used to work for a methadone clinic to help ween people off of herion

the mind of an addict is a tricky thing

Well one thing o dont understand, why narcan is a controlled substance

When it doesnt give a high and is beneficial

because it tricks the addicted mind into thinking it got what it wanted

to help bring them off of it

But why is it a controlled

I think it is a c2

because its still dangerous and you dont want people NOT addicted to get their mind needing it

i am a cig smoker, and ill be the first to admit im hardcore addicted to these damed things

Kinda bs still

tell me you are going to take them away

and my brain goes insane

its just how addiction works

A normal guy wont shoot up with no high

until his brain chemistry associates and changes for that drug

But is used to bind with the opiods so the guy wont stop breathing

then he will

slippery slope

Narcan is used to stop the overdose, not to help with withdrawal

Methadone is to help with withdrawal

maybe i am going in the wrong direction, all i am aying is addiction is difficult for those that have never tried anything to really understand

i dont know one drug from the next when it comes to perscription and whatnot

Im addicted to gambling

but i know a lot of people hooked on herion and used to be crack

So i know the issue in general

those are different people than you have ever met, i would bet

And i know war on drugs made everything worse

At least where i am at...

i dont know a lot about the exacts on the war on drugs, but i can claim to know a bit about the effects on those taking some of the worst drugs we have ever invented as a people

lost many friends to coke and herion

have to just cut them out after a while

try to help

but can only do so much

War on drugs made people into criminals, that is what it did

while the laws put people in jail

i never put that first line in front of anyone to snort, shoot whatever

there is still a bit of choice in there

after a while the addiction takes over and choice leaves their hands to a degree

but it started with a yes or no question at some point

But we closed the psych wards so it tossed a bunch of people out on the streets

did we?

are there not psychewards anymore?

In general us closed a lot of them

well there were a lot of bad ones at one point

maybe thats what got closed, but i dont know, i would like to think that had to be what happened

https://www.npr.org/2017/11/30/567477160/how-the-loss-of-u-s-psychiatric-hospitals-led-to-a-mental-health-crisis

but i cant really make that claim

Summary of it

Can research more from this if you want to

Ghee, that is one of the talking points of the NRA, NPR

well in this case, they are probably right

i can get behind what is being said here, we do have a mental health issue

hell, i could likely be considered living proof of said fact lol

not really something i would be proud of or anything... just saying

I would say that a simple "one size fits all" solution to problems, ends up fitting no one.

agreed @Khanclansith

need a bunch of options, so everyone can find something they can work with

not sure anyone really knows how to make something like that really come about

which i guess puts us where we are in that respect lol

Well it is a question of is it government responsibility to care for them at expense of budget, because it leads to waste and fraud

Anytime a government program is established, there is going to be fraud and waste

well in some cases i could see it as a yes, and some cases a no, which is why options are needed

Now how much is so, is the question

But there is no question that since the 1950's, the trend to use General Prisons as mental health facilities has been a disaster

like guys with PTSD from military action, i would surely say the government needs to help those guys out

but should the governemnt be responsible for my crazy ass, nah

And to add those from war on drugs fucked it moreso

its not their fault im a dumbass

lol

but you bring up an interesting point @Zuihou

But how do you treat those with mental illness, even moreso when they need constant care

i could get behind saying that people swept up in the "war on drugs" needed a helping hand from the governemt that created that problem

And will it not lead to government regulating people to "help" them

i think we really lost something as a society when we stopped trying to reform guys in prison like it seemed like we used to

Slippery slope for sure

maybe i was just dumb and it didnt happen like i thought it did

But at the same time

but at least it felt like the goal back in the day

its not even an option anymore it feels like

The government is trying to rehabilitate them but picking the wrong ones to do so

or picking the wrong things to rehabilitate them into

or

as a society

Like a guy who had a string of violent crime, released because his latest crime was non violent

we have stopped having the places we used to rehabilitate them into

Then he went and murdered someone

so no one really knows what to do at the moment

and no one really wants to be the people that has to figure that out

soo many eggshells

no one wants to be the guy stepping on them

i didnt hear about that guy @Zuihou where was that?

or maybe i just didnt hear the backstory of an event yet

Well for starters, national preventative health care is fine, in the scope is to provide general physical exam and annual blood test as well as a common list of generic drug supported by the government and approved by the panel of doctors, fhat is how a single payer would work better