It seems like a non sequitur

visitation was one of the issues we were discussing

none of these bills even discusses those issues

When did I discuss that?

I said men have to pay their ex wives

I also said men will fear financial ruin, marry less, and more kids will not have fathers

you did address custody as an issue

Yes I did

so when i show that incremental change has been made in reforming custody / visitation...

Such a non-response (the first part), I'm not saying that ever Greek man fucked boys but there was a definite cultural tendency towards homophilia in accient Greek. Pointing this out is by no means saying that Greeks all thinked or acted alike and is just a poorly thought out way for you to disregard the facts that what you might call societal decay might not be that.

Ah, so we can only tell if something is part of the societal decay after the fall of our civilization. Useful fucking term you've got there

What so now fathers who are being forced to work for their ex wives by the state get to visit every month?

Is this a victory?

>if i dont get everything i want then i havnt achieved anything
thats not how progress is made politically, snake, political change is implemented through incremental, realistic change

There is no pressure financial or electoral on politicians to Reform Family Law whilst there is opposite pressure to keep it all the same from a massive Feminist Lobby.
Y'all haven't even talked about that, pretending as of Politicians will talk about issues just because..

Look: the status quo is indefensible. It should be an affront to the conscience any person of good character right now.

i disagree and the feminist lobby is pretty divided in whether to support equity in divorce or no

You disagree?

What in my statement do you disagree with?

ive said repeatedly snake that the status quo should be reformed

Oh you mean you disagree with the status quo

das rite

It is disturbing that it is just an accepted part of society

I suppose any reform that moves in a better direction is a good thing

But I am not optimistic here

This extremely disturbing situation requires an extreme response, not a lukewarm incremental visitation bill

People of good character should demand change now, and reject this situation

This is not a minor issue. This is an issue that could unravel the structure of society over a few generations

i dont have the stats and i appreciate experience isnt a reliable indicator but people have talked to me about it and im not typically the one to bring it up and ive found that most people, including women feel theres a need to change

```Such a non-response (the first part), I'm not saying that ever Greek man fucked boys but there was a definite cultural tendency towards homophilia in accient Greek. Pointing this out is by no means saying that Greeks all thinked or acted alike and is just a poorly thought out way for you to disregard the facts that what you might call societal decay might not be that.```

@Krille P. You say *Greeks* were Hemophiliacs and then proceed to make the point certain Greek Philosophers played a part in formulation of Christianity as if surely they were Hemophiliacs or as if that had an impact on their contribution to Christianity...
As if Greeks contributing to Christianity justifies every single norm of the Non Christian Greek society that preceded Christianity which might be in direct contradiction. Again, Faulty Thinking.

```Ah, so we can only tell if something is part of the societal decay after the fall of our civilization. Useful fucking term you've got there```

And I'd like to introduce you to this concept among humans called Foresight. Humans are actually capable of thinking of the outcome of an act without actually performing that act.
So you can predict that if you jump from a 20 floor building you will end to dead without actually performing that act.

That's even more disturbing because it suggests that regular people find it morally reprehensible, but the state maintains it regardless

The state is thus uninterested in the concerns of citizens

i think theres always an issue in making headway in divorce though, which is the same i think plagues people in getting prenups which i think is vital, and thats people dont think it will happen to them

and tbf citizens arnt concerned overwhelmingly for as above

If left to their own devices people would not have this issue. The issue emerges due to state meddling

@Krille P. You are looking at elimination of all norms in a society if you have no Foresight. There can be no morality or law without it.

again, not sure about that, dysfunctional marriages and breakups have always been a problem and the state hasnt caused that.

If a married couple wants to split up they can, and they can come to some agreement about the kids. The one sided situation where the man's funds are seized is a result of the state using its power to force it

```again, not sure about that, dysfunctional marriages and breakups have always been a problem and the state hasnt caused that.```


The scales are different. That matters..

In fact, we've created a massive financial incentive for women to aggressively pursue divorce to get easy money

i agree and this is where feminists have actually come into bat because the laws governing this originally assumed that the man brought home the bacon and the woman enabled him and looked after the house and kids

Is it any wonder why divorce rates are so high? If you divorce you're guaranteed free money for life