Message from Tonight at 11 - DOOM in Athens #piraeus_politics_news


2019-09-10 11:07:01 UTC  

That's arse backwards - the representatives are elected essentially proportional to the population

2019-09-10 11:07:28 UTC  

If you then give the power to select senators to those representatives, you're stripping away the protections built into the system for less-populace states

2019-09-10 11:07:38 UTC  

No, the amount of seats available to a State is proportional to that basis.

2019-09-10 11:08:03 UTC  

Yes, and there are precisely 2 senators per states

2019-09-10 11:08:10 UTC  

That's the counterbalance taht you're doing away with

2019-09-10 11:09:08 UTC  

This is what the French do. Their senate is elected by citizens who themselves hold elected positions. The idea is that local officials will naturally outnumber central level officials, thus the senator will need to please local governments over central gov to get reelected. France is a very centralized state thou, by design.

2019-09-10 11:09:54 UTC  

There would continue to be two Senate seats per State, @Eccles.

2019-09-10 11:10:34 UTC  

But you're allowing the represenatitives to pick those two senators, Jeremy

2019-09-10 11:10:41 UTC  

How is that an improvement?

2019-09-10 11:10:59 UTC  

How is it not?

2019-09-10 11:11:27 UTC  

Depending on how you implement it, at best it makes no difference

2019-09-10 11:11:45 UTC  

At worst you're more likely to get senators from the majority vote in the state

2019-09-10 11:11:52 UTC  

Rather than the possibility of a mix

2019-09-10 11:12:53 UTC  

Well, tbh I wouldn't make it representatives alone to vote them in (if I were to try to implement this idea). I'd go with the French option: *all* elected officials, including city councilors and mayors and whatnot.

2019-09-10 11:13:17 UTC  

The goal of a senate like that is not to be representative thou

2019-09-10 11:13:35 UTC  

It's to incentivize distribution of power

2019-09-10 11:13:43 UTC  

the house is to be representative

2019-09-10 11:14:02 UTC  

Aye

2019-09-10 11:14:11 UTC  

and senate to prevent that representation to centralize power too ezly

2019-09-10 11:14:22 UTC  

das the idea

2019-09-10 11:15:16 UTC  

It's by no means a foolproof system thou

2019-09-10 11:15:57 UTC  

but at least it's *some* kind of systematized incentive to prevent the excessive centralization of power

2019-09-10 11:16:07 UTC  

The US system of government is failing because they've allowed too much power to be handed to the federal government

2019-09-10 11:16:14 UTC  

Read what I wrote, and you will see. As it stands now, fly-over country has little sway over the legislative futures of their elected Senators, as evinced by the past century, since the 17th was ratified, and I explained in my comment on the matter why that is the case. If you examine what has been occurring among the Senate, you have Senators from fly-over country voting for regulations that directly conflict with the economic interests of their own constituency, favoring the requests of wealthy lobbies from the coastal states you've referenced that're dictating your Senatorial elections in the middle of the country.

2019-09-10 11:16:21 UTC  

Correct.

2019-09-10 11:16:33 UTC  

it wouldn't decentralize an already centralized system thou

2019-09-10 11:16:59 UTC  

I don't think what you're suggesting will fix it

2019-09-10 11:17:08 UTC  

Do the math.

2019-09-10 11:18:23 UTC  

It's more difficult to pump money into 435 district-level, 2-year terms, than it is 100 6-year termed seats.

2019-09-10 11:19:36 UTC  

Imagine the kind of money that'd be required.

2019-09-10 11:19:45 UTC  

money is not the issue

2019-09-10 11:19:49 UTC  

this is dumb

2019-09-10 11:20:02 UTC  

They'll do it comfortably by moving their focus to the local party structures, who will control those district level appointments

2019-09-10 11:20:04 UTC  

alphabet has infinite money

2019-09-10 11:20:41 UTC  

I'm sorry, but I broadly agree with Doom - you're moving the problem, not solving it

2019-09-10 11:21:19 UTC  

I think you'd be better off moving control of more "things" from federal to state level

2019-09-10 11:21:21 UTC  

No, local and small business interests would control the appointments made by the district, just as they had for centuries before the amendment was ratified.

2019-09-10 11:21:29 UTC  

I mean I know I like to meme this a lot, but you know what's a quasi-incorruptible institution of power? A hereditary Monarch. If financial corruption is your problem, here's *a* solution 4 u... Not that that would ever fly in Muttica.

2019-09-10 11:22:10 UTC  

What makes you think the party system will just change the plan on the ground to take control of those appointments away from the district?

2019-09-10 11:22:17 UTC  

This happens in the UK, btw

2019-09-10 11:22:21 UTC  

So it's not like it won't