Message from @Sq crcl

Discord ID: 644512779067195392


2019-11-13 23:12:40 UTC  

meaning betwean 9-10 of the 28 countries would be gone. atleast if they wanted to stay net positive.

2019-11-13 23:13:38 UTC  

the EU is on shaky ground

2019-11-13 23:13:40 UTC  

and thats good

2019-11-13 23:13:43 UTC  

it needs to die

2019-11-13 23:17:34 UTC  

a trade union is a trade union. a super national governing body is a super national governing body. One is a valuable tool, the other a bureaucratic nightmare. Do not allow one to become another, and should you find yourself in one, promptly dismantle it.

2019-11-14 00:09:57 UTC  

the problem is globalists see both as on a ladder, a trade union is quite literally one step away from a super national union

2019-11-14 00:10:16 UTC  

so if you have a trade union, you're not too far from an actual union

2019-11-14 00:12:31 UTC  

Bring me the glorious EU empire

2019-11-14 00:13:28 UTC  

no thanks

2019-11-14 00:13:51 UTC  

I'll stick with not having a bloated byzantine mess of a union

2019-11-14 00:14:31 UTC  

The last glorious eu empire didn't fare so well

2019-11-14 00:14:43 UTC  

The one before that neither

2019-11-14 00:14:49 UTC  

I think it just doesn't work <:smugon:512048583806025739>

2019-11-14 00:15:11 UTC  

Well, Empires rise and fall, that's nothing new.

2019-11-14 00:15:20 UTC  

But the Roman Empire lasted quite a while.

2019-11-14 02:11:53 UTC  

The Roman Empire was built on conquest and unopposed oppression.

2019-11-14 02:12:23 UTC  

Functionally speaking the Roman Empire worked. Morally speaking, eh.

2019-11-14 06:03:59 UTC  

<:pepelaugh:544857300179877898> <:pepegun:588019479401726001>

2019-11-14 12:18:53 UTC  

@ "Functionally speaking the Roman Empire worked. Morally speaking, eh."


To which :

"Roman taxes varied over time, but was generally a couple of percent on wealth, and sometimes also on sales. However, in the provinces they could not reliably tax in this way, and instead they put a levy on the whole province payable by the governor of the province, who in return got pretty much free reign in the province. So what he taxed and how much, was up to him.

In general Roman government was run as personal fiefs. Even armies were funded and run by the generals with their own personal money, and as a result the Roman gains were really their personal gains as well, it didn't end up in the state coffers, because there were no state coffers as such.

http://www.unrv.com/economy/roman-taxes.php

http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/299558?uid=3738840&uid=2129&uid=2&uid=70&uid=4&sid=21101954265801

2019-11-14 12:23:38 UTC  

The Roman empire was hilariously corrupt

2019-11-14 12:23:40 UTC  

And yes, there was all kinds of slavery too, freedom of speech was done completely differently as of today... Etc.

BUT


IMAGINE

Not being a slave
Paying only a couple percent 'tax' directly to the local provider
Oh.. And all local officials having to be economically responsible for all decisions they assist the population with

2019-11-14 12:24:38 UTC  

Hilariously corrupt as judged by modern standards.

2019-11-14 12:24:43 UTC  

Not really, the governor had a fixed term and it was basically a race to extort as much out of your province before the time ran out

2019-11-14 12:24:53 UTC  

Which is not a fair comparison.

2019-11-14 12:25:23 UTC  

Easy. No state "coffers' no headache

2019-11-14 12:26:20 UTC  

That said, the governing system of Rome was not fit for purpose, once Rome reached certain size.

2019-11-14 12:26:27 UTC  

I'd say Roman political thought was sophisticated enough to make the corruption unexcusable

2019-11-14 12:26:46 UTC  

What's not easy is to stop the human heart from 'naturally' levitating towards power in the absence of a happy childhood.

2019-11-14 12:27:08 UTC  

The governing system was unsustainable and Rome was doomed to fail sooner or later.

2019-11-14 12:27:34 UTC  

tbh the only empire that cam close to not being a corrupt mess was the British Empire

2019-11-14 12:27:38 UTC  

(unsustainable at that size)

2019-11-14 12:28:15 UTC  

Yeah Rome was over extended as hell

2019-11-14 12:28:27 UTC  

particularly in the west

2019-11-14 12:29:28 UTC  

I have a suspicion that looking at fall of Rome was one of the reasons for 2nd amendment.

2019-11-14 12:29:42 UTC  

i think thats a bit of a stetch imo

2019-11-14 12:29:47 UTC  

stretch

2019-11-14 12:30:13 UTC  

Could you explain?

2019-11-14 12:31:11 UTC  

The way the state/cohesion started falling apart once army professionalized.

2019-11-14 12:31:41 UTC  

The way the army/pretorian guard became the ultimate arbiter in later Rome.

2019-11-14 12:32:16 UTC  

That was largely due to state force being divorced from general populus.

2019-11-14 12:32:42 UTC  

hmm I'm gonna have to disagree I'd say they learnt the lesson that the military must be subject to the civil authority