Message from Deleted User in /leftypol/ International #english


2018-02-02 01:16:55 UTC  

@Builderelf Sources?

2018-02-02 01:17:03 UTC  

Germany? Corporatist?

2018-02-02 01:18:07 UTC  

lulz yeah germany was basically a racist social democracy

2018-02-02 01:20:04 UTC  

mussolini was a staunch sorelianist

2018-02-02 01:44:47 UTC  

I disagree with that.

2018-02-02 01:46:00 UTC  

>mixed economy

2018-02-02 01:46:04 UTC  

>welfare state

2018-02-02 01:46:11 UTC  

>wages

2018-02-02 01:58:11 UTC  

>Welfare state
What do you mean by that?
>Mixed economy
If by mixed, you mean both government and owned properties with a common goal, then sure.
>Wages
What relevance does this have?

2018-02-02 02:00:12 UTC  

@Builderelf I think that when people mention fascism, they usually get the idea of italy, and how it had some corpratism, but they forget, that italian fascism, national socialism, legionaireism, falange, and more, had many differences, with a common idea.

2018-02-02 02:00:50 UTC  

all of those except hitlerian NS yes

2018-02-02 02:01:05 UTC  

capitalism is to individual

2018-02-02 02:01:11 UTC  

communism to class

2018-02-02 02:01:15 UTC  

fascism to state

2018-02-02 02:01:19 UTC  

N"S" to race

2018-02-02 02:01:21 UTC  

Unless it is somewhere like vichy france where it was a german/italian occupied place, it would most likely have an independant system.

2018-02-02 02:02:11 UTC  

Okay, from what I see and what I'm researching right now, I could definetly see @Krieg#0336's arguement for Germany being a "racist social democracy". For instance:
-Taxation was high
-Government spending was through the roof
-Private business was allowed to operate
-Healthcare was a thing
-Keynes himself LIKED the Germany economy
-Pensions were even given out, apparently

However, I'm also seeing elements of totalitarianism in there. For instance, State-Run Trade Unions designed to squeeze out productivity in factories. Also, military spending took was as high as 32% of the budget-- that doesn't sound like a Social Democracy at all! Additionally, the reason that public projects such as job programs and industry protectionism seems to be mainly for the sake of increasing productivy of home industries, not for the sake of basic human rights, as it is in Nordic countries.

So in other words, I'd place Hitlerist economics as an Authoritarian-Right version of Social Democracy. Not quite corporatism, not quite social democracy, a strange kind of militaritic totalitarian welfare state.

2018-02-02 02:02:26 UTC  

@Krieg#0336 Fascism and national socialism do not believe in devolution of the class, which is something that communism and socialism want, but rather they want both the worker, and the owner, and the government cooperating for the benefit of the nation.

2018-02-02 02:03:08 UTC  

why yes, this is true. I know a fascist friend that claims that fascism calls for "Class Collaboration, not Class Warfare", so thats correct @Deleted User

2018-02-02 02:03:39 UTC  

well duh its easier to work together when one class isn't fucking the other

2018-02-02 02:03:43 UTC  

@Builderelf That is one of the biggest characteristics of national socialism, as well as the italian, romanian, spanish, and more, is that it cannot be mapped on a simple political scale that is determined by an alogorithm.

2018-02-02 02:03:45 UTC  

I would also agree that fascist economics has more diversity than people give it credit for.

2018-02-02 02:04:08 UTC  

fascism isn't an economic system more of a world view

2018-02-02 02:04:16 UTC  

or principles

2018-02-02 02:04:31 UTC  

Then again @Deleted User , thats because political compass tests are actually cancerous ways of viewing politics

2018-02-02 02:04:40 UTC  

closest thing to experiencing fascism in america would be like being in the military or a sports team

2018-02-02 02:05:06 UTC  

yeah, fascism has more roots in politics if anything. Probably why history classes don't cover it's economy very much and why fascist economics are so diverse.

2018-02-02 02:05:31 UTC  

i mean Mussolini called Stalin a fascist

2018-02-02 02:05:38 UTC  

@Builderelf Ah yes, according to MK, next leap, and a squires trial, a person needs to do what they are best at, and using that skill, they produce products and more, to benefit the state, or that is the very generalized and summarized version of it.

2018-02-02 02:05:45 UTC  

@Krieg#0336 Citation needed.

2018-02-02 02:06:15 UTC  

Red Fascism

2018-02-02 02:06:36 UTC  

@Krieg#0336 big oof

2018-02-02 02:06:47 UTC  

@Builderelf History classes hardly teach you anything.

2018-02-02 02:07:09 UTC  

true

2018-02-02 02:07:23 UTC  

but then again, my latest history classes have been a lot better

2018-02-02 02:07:46 UTC  

for instance, my current history teacher is W O K E af

2018-02-02 02:08:06 UTC  

I don't think that makes the course inhereintly better, however.

2018-02-02 02:08:30 UTC  

he legit knows what Mutualism, Anarcho-Syndicalism, Marx's Labor Theory of Value etc. are. I have NEVER seen a history teacher talk about any of that. He's pretty fricking lit.

2018-02-02 02:08:50 UTC  

hell, he's the sponsor for my socialist club

2018-02-02 02:08:56 UTC  

so overall a pretty cool dude

2018-02-02 02:09:03 UTC  

i mean true @Deleted User