Why?

When we know what the best thing for our people really is

Peak white flourishing is white flourishing that exists, is real, and is stable

States, especially ethnostates, don't exist and are not stable in concept or practice

@Nemets Who are the most anti-white group in South Africa? What kind of blacks are coming for the farms?

Why does this place always get interesting this time of night when I need sleep?

Oh well night guys. Thank care.

@Jacob, I disagree. The left is always using utopian ideals, like communism. Many moderate leftists just don’t believe in such utopian ideas. But it it pushes the Overton window nonetheless. Maybe we aren’t pushing the discussion hard enough by using distancing verbiage.

Murdoch on his podcast had a great, simple approach: "Be pro white. Try to make the future for white people better, try to make your land more white and not less. Anyone who is pro white is a potential ally."

That's a great point with the Overton Window @dudelsäcke

@Jacob EFF seems top villains

What I really want to impress is that no one will stake that radical ideal for us. And the more we promote it the more acceptable everyone a little more lenient looks, pulling the overton window our way

@Jacob https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_Freedom_Fighters

These bits are the biggest worry I know of.

Still, advocating for homelands for all people where they live around those they share a common culture and identity with is a more "reasonable" sounding way of expressing the same idea @dudelsäcke

Cause like, if ethnostate guys are a fact of politics, by comparison just being hard on immigration looks moderate

@ThisIsChris

@Ald That's honestly a really good point and probably the best argument I've heard in favor of the "ethnostate" strategy

Though, I think there should be a balance between pulling the Overton Window, and sounding realistic

We should sound radical but not to the point that it's science fiction y

@Jacob, I agree. But the dissident right needs a spectrum of commentators who are pushing varying degrees of our beliefs. In polite company, say “homelands” for all. But maybe IE’s place is more to the right...? I donno. From Tomi to Tucker to Lauren to... Where does IE fit?

@Ald "if ethnostate guys are a fact of politics, by comparison just being hard on immigration looks moderate" that's a big if though because "if ethnostate guys are a fact of politics" presumes they can ever be successful, which they can't in our time or place or any forseeable time and place

"Any foreseeable time and place"

@Ald IE also doesn't have to do everything. A decentralized right wing /white well being movement is anti-fragile and multiple approaches by separate groups can help even without teamwork. IE has the highest potential for growth as "good cop." We shouldn't either endorse or disavow other groups like Patriot Front. We do our thing they do theirs. An explicit ethnostate group can do their thing too.

What are we even laboring for then

If you can't foresee any time and place

where a white nation for whites is plausible

@dudelsäcke That's a good point. Maybe guys advocating for an "ethnostate" do have a place, but I think there's a strong need for something like IE

@Ald white flourishing generally. fewer specifics means opponents can't pin us down on rhetorical points

So you want plausibility but fewer specifics. I guess the ideal on that view is just "Shit be how it is"

I prefer to call it racial self-determination of sovereignty, but flourishing works too.

The existing ethnostate groups (League of the South, Northwest Front) don't have good records. If a new group rose that could only be a good thing, but it benefits IE and everyone for IE to not be too entangled in such a group.

@Ald given that things are how they are, we are working towards a better country for white people in the ways we can, and discussing ethnostates would set us back

Not really though? The fact the word ethnostate is even in the political vocabulary now is a victory

@Ald I disagree with that, it's in the voccabulary for hostile media to whip out and scare possible allies away from us

The media is blind. A lot of people hear their rhetoric and think the opposite. Even normies.

Well are we trying to accomplish something or be non threatening?

Advocating for white interests has a nice ring to it. I think that's what AmRen terms there work.

We're trying to accomplish things and we're definitely not trying to threaten anyone

What about the guys we really want to whom ethnostate sounds appealing? Who do they join? Idiot wn 1.0 type groups?

@Ald they need to do some introspection on what they really want. if they want to live in fantasy land then they shouldn't join IE

I joined IE because I see it as the most plausible vehicle for the existence and flourishing of our people, which in the end necessitates absolute homogeneity

We should have various side projects at various levels of Overton-pushing that seem unaffiliated with IE.