Message from @Summī Imperator, 呪い殿

Discord ID: 487058788508106752


2018-09-05 23:50:06 UTC  

But if one local community makes too big of an impact it ruins it for others @campodin

2018-09-05 23:50:30 UTC  

The whole “ you have the freedom to swing your fist so long as it doesn’t hit my nose”

2018-09-05 23:54:17 UTC  

It takes more than one local community to "ruin it for others" unless they are just dumping toxins in the water supply or the like. But that goes beyond developing industry. Not causing harm to others is not the same as conservation

2018-09-06 00:03:19 UTC  

So then it shouldn't be up to the local community?

2018-09-06 00:04:14 UTC  

Because who decides what is and is not right when the community that has decided this is fine and it works for them, but the other community is disproportionately affected by that choice?

2018-09-06 00:04:47 UTC  

It's far easier to dump toxins than to clean them.

2018-09-06 00:23:17 UTC  

The question was on industry vs conservation. That is what I was addressing. Not allowing someone to dump toxins in the drinking water is not the same as conservation.

2018-09-06 00:25:53 UTC  

Conservation is trying to preserve the state of nature, and maintain a healthy amount of biodiversity in your environment. Disallowing actions like dumping toxic waste is for the purpose of preserving human life and health.

2018-09-06 00:26:46 UTC  

erm not nessecarily

2018-09-06 00:26:48 UTC  

One local community alone cannot ruin conservation efforts

2018-09-06 00:28:22 UTC  

No? So say a community decides to build a dam

2018-09-06 00:28:54 UTC  

And that floods a large portion of the land the other community was focusing conservation efforts.

2018-09-06 00:29:28 UTC  

In turn this causes the fish to stop reproducing as they can no longer get to their spawning grounds.

2018-09-06 00:30:30 UTC  

This leads to a build up of heavy metals in the water and algae blooms due to nothing eating the algae anymore. This leads to the water becoming toxic and deoxidized.

2018-09-06 00:32:00 UTC  

This isn't a hypothetical either. This is what is happening in Quebec.

2018-09-06 00:32:54 UTC  

If you honestly believe that one can not ruin something for the many then you're ignorant, or you don't care.

2018-09-06 00:36:25 UTC  

@Summī Imperator, 呪い殿 first off, who built that dam?

2018-09-06 00:36:47 UTC  

It would be the one who chose industry.

2018-09-06 00:37:18 UTC  

Not my question

2018-09-06 00:37:19 UTC  

The community needs electricity to run machines.

2018-09-06 00:37:44 UTC  

Unless you mean that ultimately the decision lies with the state to build a dam.

2018-09-06 00:37:56 UTC  

No

2018-09-06 00:38:04 UTC  

Who built that dam?

2018-09-06 00:38:13 UTC  

Uh...

2018-09-06 00:38:19 UTC  

In Quebec

2018-09-06 00:38:30 UTC  

Oh, well that's stupid. It was Quebec.

2018-09-06 00:38:31 UTC  

The one you used as an example

2018-09-06 00:38:44 UTC  

So the province allowed it.

2018-09-06 00:38:47 UTC  

In other words not a local community

2018-09-06 00:38:57 UTC  

And the utility used the authority to build it.

2018-09-06 00:39:12 UTC  

It was allowed by the community.

2018-09-06 00:39:24 UTC  

Via the Democratic process.

2018-09-06 00:39:38 UTC  

And lack of resistance.

2018-09-06 00:39:45 UTC  

Democratic process is awful, but that is a side point

2018-09-06 00:39:48 UTC  

It was also welcomed.

2018-09-06 00:39:56 UTC  

As it created jobs.

2018-09-06 00:40:02 UTC  

Neither does democracy = local community

2018-09-06 00:40:06 UTC  

And an economy.

2018-09-06 00:40:33 UTC  

And again, how does that mitigate the affect the one community might have on the others?

2018-09-06 00:40:53 UTC  

Because democracy serves the majority interest, not the community interest

2018-09-06 00:40:57 UTC  

I used it as an example of the effects a dam can have.