Message from @Dwarf

Discord ID: 450692319579078656


2018-05-28 16:04:31 UTC  

What do you mean?

2018-05-28 16:04:53 UTC  

The means of production were owned by the workers

2018-05-28 16:05:07 UTC  

May I continue?

2018-05-28 16:05:15 UTC  

So

2018-05-28 16:05:45 UTC  

Bolsheviks gave the big landlords' property to the peasants who divided it equally

2018-05-28 16:06:23 UTC  

But these small farms weren't effective enough and couldn't supply Russia with all the food it needed

2018-05-28 16:06:46 UTC  

But communists had to deal with it during the NEP

2018-05-28 16:06:58 UTC  

how were they when the people who owned the means of production were not allowed to sell their productions?

2018-05-28 16:07:19 UTC  

Ownership =/= right to sell

2018-05-28 16:07:38 UTC  

How can you sell anything if you're the only possible owner?

2018-05-28 16:07:55 UTC  

The government can still block private owners from selling under capitalism, if it wishes. So that isn't really relevant @Adoring Fan

2018-05-28 16:08:03 UTC  

This too

2018-05-28 16:08:06 UTC  

So

2018-05-28 16:08:30 UTC  

Capitalist America is hella comfy

2018-05-28 16:08:31 UTC  

During the NEP communists allowed private enterprises to rebuild the country ASAP

2018-05-28 16:08:40 UTC  

@Fuju if it wishes, yet it doesn't do that nearly to the extent that the soviet union did.

2018-05-28 16:08:53 UTC  

So what?

2018-05-28 16:09:12 UTC  

NEP was actually a policy of state capitalism like in China today

2018-05-28 16:09:12 UTC  

The workers still owned the mp, and that's what matters regarding your original question.

2018-05-28 16:09:44 UTC  

then what is the merit of owning the means of production? You can do nothing with it

2018-05-28 16:10:22 UTC  

@GucciToiletSalesman not really no.

2018-05-28 16:10:25 UTC  

You can take part in deciding how the money should be spent

2018-05-28 16:11:22 UTC  

You do realise that question would apply to both private and publicly owned means of production, right? @Adoring Fan

2018-05-28 16:11:50 UTC  

@Advocatus Diaboli that is like saying you can take part in elections. Your one vote changes nothing

2018-05-28 16:12:11 UTC  

^

2018-05-28 16:12:14 UTC  

So what?

2018-05-28 16:12:23 UTC  

Are elections useless?

2018-05-28 16:12:26 UTC  

How is that even comparable

2018-05-28 16:12:47 UTC  

elections are useless, yes

2018-05-28 16:12:57 UTC  

democracy is a false god

2018-05-28 16:13:09 UTC  

I forgot you're a fascist

2018-05-28 16:13:23 UTC  

Hope you guys have fun debating while I play some nice video games

2018-05-28 16:13:29 UTC  

Lol

2018-05-28 16:13:30 UTC  

Enjoy

2018-05-28 16:13:40 UTC  

What games and what platform?

2018-05-28 16:14:44 UTC  

it doesn't matter if I'm a fascist or not, that is besides the point

2018-05-28 16:14:54 UTC  

democracy is a wholly failed system

2018-05-28 16:15:13 UTC  

There is a reason all 3 of Aristotle, Plato and Socrates hated it

2018-05-28 16:15:25 UTC  

Bourgeois democracy is indeed a failure

2018-05-28 16:15:41 UTC  

But it's the best existing system so far

2018-05-28 16:15:57 UTC  

Never expected to hear a commie say that