Message from @Thule-Gesellschaft [☩]

Discord ID: 497996520012906506


2018-10-06 04:52:07 UTC  

now it's better

2018-10-06 04:52:26 UTC  

can't lie tbh

2018-10-06 04:52:32 UTC  

I am not really religious

2018-10-06 04:52:45 UTC  

Theism has nothing to do with religion though.

2018-10-06 04:52:53 UTC  

perhaps

2018-10-06 04:53:08 UTC  

I was brought up in a Muslim conservative country

2018-10-06 04:53:28 UTC  

I can label myself as an exmuslim

2018-10-06 04:53:36 UTC  

So I assume you've read the Kalam Cosmological Argument

2018-10-06 04:53:51 UTC  

I haven't

2018-10-06 04:54:46 UTC  

@Cawaii

1. Whatever begins to exist has a cause.
2. The universe began to exist.
3. Therefore the universe has a cause.
4. There cannot be an infinite regress of causes.
5. There cannot be a circular causation.
6. Therefore the universe was caused (either directly or indirectly) by an uncaused cause (i.e that had no beginning).
7. The uncaused cause must transcend space and time, and be sentient.
8. But to say a sentient being that transcends space and time brought the universe into existence, is to say that God exists.
9. Therefore God exists.

2018-10-06 04:56:36 UTC  

One of my main points of Agnostic view is the "I'll believe it when I see it" argument, and I love to factor in the ideas that there could be more Gods than thought and believed on the planet Earth, and a true God could exist as the Universe

2018-10-06 04:56:59 UTC  

I'll believe it when I see it is anchoring truth to empiricism

2018-10-06 04:57:03 UTC  

Which is subjective/a preference

2018-10-06 04:57:56 UTC  

if brett likes bud lite he shouldnt be in the supreme court

2018-10-06 04:58:44 UTC  

True, empiricism really does lock out certain theories and arguments necessary for understanding the universe around us, but the basis of being an Agnostic is purely being subjective.

2018-10-06 04:59:05 UTC  

Does God exist or not, I'll believe it when I see it.

2018-10-06 04:59:31 UTC  

>when I see it

2018-10-06 04:59:40 UTC  

how would you be able to "see" omniscience and omnipotence?

2018-10-06 04:59:47 UTC  

hint: you can't

2018-10-06 05:00:16 UTC  

It all comes back down to being subjective.

2018-10-06 05:00:22 UTC  

that's not an argument

2018-10-06 05:00:35 UTC  

you're just saying outright "lol I don't care because it's my opinion"

2018-10-06 05:00:44 UTC  

Without God you have an infinite regress of subjectivity

2018-10-06 05:01:09 UTC  

btw calling something subjective is an objective claim about subjectivity, which imo undermines the ontological potency of subjectivist arguments

2018-10-06 05:01:12 UTC  

nothing is subjective

2018-10-06 05:01:14 UTC  

that is a meme

2018-10-06 05:01:22 UTC  

Empiricism can be embedded within a greater science, which can be embedded in a greater science, within a greater science, etc.

2018-10-06 05:03:12 UTC  

So just out of curiosity, is your theist belief the belief that god is the cosmos?

2018-10-06 05:03:23 UTC  

No

2018-10-06 05:03:29 UTC  

To me, He is the Unmoved Mover

2018-10-06 05:03:35 UTC  

Can you elaborate?

2018-10-06 05:03:50 UTC  

^ the 9 point argument I posted

2018-10-06 05:04:01 UTC  

He is the anchor to the causal chain

2018-10-06 05:04:32 UTC  

He exists outside the natural world, He is the unactualized actualizer.

2018-10-06 05:04:43 UTC  

He initiated all movement. The Unmoved Mover.

2018-10-06 05:04:45 UTC  

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/496515828372602890/497997619923124236/1505096343126.png

2018-10-06 05:04:50 UTC  

God bless America

2018-10-06 05:05:01 UTC  

👌🏼

2018-10-06 05:08:17 UTC  

Well fuck me I guess I just became a Theist

2018-10-06 05:08:21 UTC  

That makes too much sense

2018-10-06 05:08:27 UTC  

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