Message from @raqdog

Discord ID: 506484503795990534


2018-10-29 14:34:17 UTC  

It's probably even more complicated than the weather. It's like chaos theory. Where the variables change to quickly ad dramatically to predict what the effect of a butterflies flapping its wings will be

2018-10-29 14:36:59 UTC  

and the trotsky quote i posted literally had nothng to do with computers but quite literally the opposite. your computers and models have to account for human want and need that are hard to account for with computers

2018-10-29 14:37:45 UTC  

Yeah that's a recipe for disaster

2018-10-29 14:39:19 UTC  

Socialism thrives under war. Capitalism thrives better.

2018-10-29 14:40:17 UTC  

If you want socialism to work, there needs to be more of a communal goal other than to peacefully exist.

2018-10-29 14:42:04 UTC  

Capitalism is war, you compete daily to make yourself better than your competitors. Socialism is like a stagnant halt to progress, unless there is a bigger goal in mind, like getting to the moon or bankrupting the US in the Cold War.

2018-10-29 14:43:07 UTC  

But the individuals, I just don't see how they would feel motivated to do anything unless they are heavily propagandized by the state

2018-10-29 14:54:39 UTC  

@Egoy true, that's why I said we had to work on the development of quantum computing until we have reached a sufficient level of computing power to calculate economic processes. When I meant by "supply and demand" in a socialist economy, I mean this law would still be in place, as supercomputers measure the demand and supply of every commodity, and then allocate relevant amount of production to each sector.
Yes, human wants is a reflection of commodities being produced and sold, it will always account for it.

2018-10-29 14:58:18 UTC  

@raqdog capitalism is merely transitionary, socialism depends on the industrial base of capitalism to build itself up. Capitalism, like any other ideology, is not permenant and will give way to another economic ideology superior to itself. In a socialist society, there will be always a slight surplus of commodities, in the case of unforseen and marginal fluctuations in the consumption of consumer goods. If this is the case, supercomputers would account for it and draw back production from relevant sectors and increase production in a sector where its lacking.
Yes, socialism is a communal goal, it can only be achieved when the working class is educated about socialism and class consciousness. Socialism has nothing to do with the state, decisions are made by the people and the people alone.

2018-10-29 15:02:36 UTC  

Socialism IS a communal goal? Or socialism NEEDS a communal goal? That's the difference here

2018-10-29 15:02:48 UTC  

why do we need a competitive nature? the state, or the people actually, have far more resources than to innovate under a capitalist society, where you depend on your own capital. Innovation would skyrocket under socialism, because innovation under capitalism is only driven by profit

2018-10-29 15:02:53 UTC  

socialism is a communal goal

2018-10-29 15:02:59 UTC  

achieved by the working class united

2018-10-29 15:06:12 UTC  

People who generate the most successful ideas and markets in a capitalist society are hardly ever driven by just profit. Their companies end up being sustained by it and thrive off of profit because people want more of it. And it's a useful byproduct that sustains more innovation

2018-10-29 15:07:09 UTC  

How do you see a Silicon Valley emerge in a socialist society?

2018-10-29 15:07:32 UTC  

Or a spacex?

2018-10-29 15:07:41 UTC  

Or an amazon?

2018-10-29 15:07:46 UTC  

Or Walmart

2018-10-29 15:08:07 UTC  

oh no, this profit only benefits the bourgeois, ever since do the workers enjoy the fruits of their own labour? Profit keeps the capitalist system going, if not it would collapse. No matter what the capitalists are on a personal level, without profit, there would be no capitalism

2018-10-29 15:08:35 UTC  

@raqdog they would be all communally owned by the people, and thus far more resources would be allocated to it

2018-10-29 15:08:35 UTC  

Walgreens didn't even use a business model that accounts for profit. They accounted for number customer visits.

2018-10-29 15:08:52 UTC  

so how would a company operate without profit?

2018-10-29 15:08:59 UTC  

there would be no incentive to

2018-10-29 15:09:07 UTC  

just look at pathetic NASA

2018-10-29 15:09:14 UTC  

only has a budget of 20 billion

2018-10-29 15:09:18 UTC  

If they used a business model that focused on profit they wouldn't have even come up with the idea to place a store every few blocks

2018-10-29 15:09:29 UTC  

while the US military has a budget of 500 billion dollars to fund imperialism

2018-10-29 15:09:50 UTC  

@raqdog so how would a business be sustained without profit?

2018-10-29 15:09:55 UTC  

tell me that

2018-10-29 15:09:58 UTC  

NASA has no goal

2018-10-29 15:10:10 UTC  

pathetic, right?

2018-10-29 15:10:17 UTC  

channeling funds into the military

2018-10-29 15:10:24 UTC  

instead of investing into science

2018-10-29 15:10:28 UTC  

Their goal for the last year was to maintain the space station, as per congressional law

2018-10-29 15:10:38 UTC  

Or last several years I mean

2018-10-29 15:10:54 UTC  

yea, when the space race was over, there was no reason to extend it

2018-10-29 15:11:10 UTC  

Our military is the largest threat deterrent and humanitarian effort on the planet

2018-10-29 15:11:45 UTC  

yes, I'm pretty sure Latin American nations faced posed a threat to the USA in the 60s and 70s militarily

2018-10-29 15:12:14 UTC  

ever heard of Chile attempting to land in San Francisco to establish socialism?

2018-10-29 15:12:17 UTC  

A business sustains it self on profit, but also on risk, gotta take risk

2018-10-29 15:12:33 UTC  

yes and so?