Message from @LOLTRON

Discord ID: 463460625037656065


2018-07-02 21:38:02 UTC  

Universal Basic Income.

2018-07-02 21:39:34 UTC  

I have a feeling that as more and more complex tasks become automated, that more and more people will find themselves unemployable, or else will find that their labor is worth less than the cost of living.

2018-07-02 21:40:25 UTC  

But conversely, those few highly intelligent and skilled individuals will find their labor in extremely high demand and will see their wages skyrocket.

2018-07-02 21:40:46 UTC  

I mean, the concept of a universal basic income only applies so long as there ARE producers. So long as there are things that people want.

2018-07-02 21:41:02 UTC  

And the owners of the automation technology will reap the majority of the economic surplus.

2018-07-02 21:42:01 UTC  

See, this is why I never liked Automation systems in Tekkit.

2018-07-02 21:42:02 UTC  

I think there will be producers, but we may find ourselves in a situation where producers are no longer the majority, which depending on your point of view may make universal suffrage untenable.

2018-07-02 21:42:46 UTC  

At a certain point the question becomes, "Why even play?"

2018-07-02 21:43:05 UTC  

you made me choke on my own spit

2018-07-02 21:43:18 UTC  

the leap from UBI to modded Minecraft

2018-07-02 21:43:22 UTC  

lol

2018-07-02 21:43:22 UTC  

what a twist

2018-07-02 21:43:35 UTC  

I mean, I see it very similarly.

2018-07-02 21:44:06 UTC  

Yeah, I understand the point about automating more stuff

2018-07-02 21:44:40 UTC  

But not everything can be automated.

2018-07-02 21:45:54 UTC  

The implications from the question are pretty staggering, as well. If only a few entities were automating everything, what are they automating for?

2018-07-02 21:46:17 UTC  

Where is the money people are purchasing things coming from? I can only see high taxes on the producers

2018-07-02 21:46:38 UTC  

I concede that the 95%-5% split used in my hypothetical society is unlikely, but we're on the verge of a massive transformation.

2018-07-02 21:46:52 UTC  

What can't be automated?

2018-07-02 21:46:53 UTC  

At which point, why are the producers even producing if the money is being taken away from them to supply the UBI

2018-07-02 21:47:03 UTC  

Saying something can't be automated just suggests a failure of imagination.

2018-07-02 21:47:24 UTC  

Ask Siri to tell you a joke.

2018-07-02 21:47:36 UTC  

Well, the producers aren't being taxed to the point of being impoverished. They'd probably still be massively wealthy simply due to the vastly increased disparity in wealrth.

2018-07-02 21:47:52 UTC  

Presumably they'd at least be making UBI

2018-07-02 21:48:07 UTC  

Like if you have an income of a billion dollars and the tax rate is 50% you're still in gold plated yacht territory.

2018-07-02 21:48:14 UTC  

But their work and income would have to subsidize the people who are buying stuff from them

2018-07-02 21:48:48 UTC  

Drinking their own piss, in a way. It's not conducive to how modern economics works.

2018-07-02 21:49:08 UTC  

Hence why I described the free-riders as parasitic.

2018-07-02 21:49:40 UTC  

The system falls apart before it gets to that point.

2018-07-02 21:49:40 UTC  

In that extreme hypothetical example the producers would have clear incentive to curtail the free-riders.

2018-07-02 21:50:04 UTC  

I should get ya'll and lotus and start up Timcast IBS

2018-07-02 21:50:29 UTC  

In a less clear and less extreme real-world example, the people paying taxes would have incentive to prevent increases to UBI beyond subsistence.

2018-07-02 21:50:33 UTC  

I know Rye can be cogent

2018-07-02 21:50:36 UTC  

in VC

2018-07-02 21:50:47 UTC  

somewhat.

2018-07-02 21:50:48 UTC  

And would have incentive to lower the number of people receiving UBI.

2018-07-02 21:52:10 UTC  

Money, especially not backed by the gold standard, is essentially worth a miniscule percentage of the labor in the nation under that currency.

2018-07-02 21:53:57 UTC  

In order to have a UBI, you have to tax the labor to fund it, or print more money - which decreases that percentage of labor claim

2018-07-02 21:54:11 UTC  

So when everything is automated and AI does all the thinking our contribution will be creativity and making problems heh... also, how many ppl this kind of environment can sustain? UBI will probably be free food, basic healthcare, shelter, basic clothing and utilities. For everything extra we will have to earn somekind of "bitcoin".

2018-07-02 21:55:54 UTC  

gold has asighned value same as shells (polinesian islands i think)... you can assighn value to healthy living ... walk is already measurable... it can be mined

2018-07-02 21:56:20 UTC  

Presumably, it would be sustainable to the extent that resources such as metal, stone, necessary farmland, etc can stretch