dont feed him

-declines the test-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY9eSzB-KbU

the unfollow feature on facebook is great

similarly, the block on discord

it's like editing reality

by manipulating perception

DAE suffocation?

❤ SUFFOCATION ❤

ALTHOUGH I AM STILL IN LOVE WITH "EFFIGY OF THE FORGOTTEN"

EARLY DEATH METAL RULES

yeah block on facebook is good

do it @rebekka888

its really short

no

why not

please do it @rebekka888

nope

why not

why wont you @rebekka888

because i dont want to

why not though

its so short

because i do not care to take a short test

I would appreciate it

i do not care

alright then

see fallot

see what

no, I dont think its that

but point taken

MBTI strikes me as psuedoscience

it is, its magic

Thank you for your honesty

I do sometimes think this album is better than Effigy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfxdulBAZEA

I still think some of the pseudoscience claims are predicated on a belief that MBTI is supposed to be predictive

most critics aren't pushing refined methodology criticisms

its too much effort to tease apart the whole mess underlying such statements with every interaction

between the INTs

on the P side you get "can I confirm it"

but on the J side the concerns are more

"is it true" and "is it useful"

truth-o-meter comes built in

well I agree it's better to look at the whole thing as magic, especially in the hermetic sense

of that word

yeah, that's how I mean it

sorcery

alchemy

yeah

Breeding the Spawn is their creative peak.

@fallot So which is the best test to take?

I remember you linked m e some months ago but I can't remember their names

I agree it is their creative peak

@Spinal the test I linked before is the one I now ask people to take

it has some advantages, overall I remain displeased with testing

there is no best test, there are only good test takers

some types type themselves easily

some types (not MBTI) may not have sufficient insight, personal honesty, or take the test seriously enough

Ok

Effigy is probably still the better album

you're not very ambiguous Spinal

unless you found the designation to be jarring

You mean my results?

I've found that one's results with the MBTI change with age.

That's interesting, and seems reasonable

yes, your results

your results can change with age due to personal growth

your type doesn't change

if your type changes

MBTI is worthless

Hmmm. Aren't results and type tied together?

there's a lot of room to mistype

I think best results for reproducibility

are like 0.7

@fallot I wasn't planning on taking further tests, just curious

in that case yes, best as far as I am concerned

It is magic and therefore subjective. How much worth does it have in explaining a person's psychology?

I think a lot

there is nothing comparable

it can give you a holistic insight into many different aspects of a person's behaviour

motivations etc.

@fallot Do you know who else got the same type?

My impulses are different from what I actually do

it takes a little time to see the descriptions as something more than the sum of their parts

i thought this server got shoah'd?

or was that fake news

because I try to patch up my weaknesses

it didn't, but there was some danger of it

it need only be sufficiently vague so as to allow persons to have ah-ha moments. Functionally equivalent with horoscopes or palm readers.

I hear that criticism often

it doesn't really stand

there's a big difference between reading a horoscope (which I've never found to have any value)

My experience has been that as I matured and changed the quality of my thinking, my behavior changed and so did my MBTI results.

and reading your MBTI profile

@pashtun fake news

while can seem like your mind if being read or something

what is your MBTI @Claire

@Spinal , you are an INTJ right?

me, @UOC , maybe this @༺པརབྱར།བསངཇ༻ guy though he could be INTP as well

One thing that doesn't seem to change are a person's aptitudes. I've taken the Johnson O'Connor tests and those still hold true today.

@Nester

@fallot iirc I got what they called INTJ-A

that's just the bullshit of a certain website

Alright

@fallot I don't even remember anymore. I've jotted them down somewhere. I took them a number of years apart and promptly dismissed them.

why dont you take it now

http://jupiter-34.appspot.com/

What is a quanifiable difference between horoscopes and MBTI so that I may determine whether or not you are making truth statements rather than value judgements?

I can't give you anything like that

the best thing would be

experience it yourself

do the test, find out your type, then read a type profile

which I will link you a few of when you do the test

then you can make up your mind how vague or specific it is

I may trust planets that have been around for billions of years and their influence on me before I trust the MBTI.

@fallot It is very interesting, I'll give you that.

That would seem to validate my criticism.

Truth be told, I remember being impressed with the accuracy of the MBTI.

but what was your criticism @༺པརབྱར།བསངཇ༻

I don't, however, think it is some permanent assessment of me and my thinking.

it is already validated

don't decide its relevance before the fact @Claire

its a permanent assessment that you are a woman

that means something about your cognition

why can there not be other similar categories?

Wait. It's a gender determiner?

it appears validated in the same sense that I might claim to be able to throw a rock into 30 foot diameter hole.

*of course*

@༺པརབྱར།བསངཇ༻ what are you trying to say

that MBTI is bullshit?

Yes.

Yes, being female does mean that I think differently. So does my IQ.

I can't give you anything to make you see it is or isn't

except you going through the process

because its subjective

there may be other aspects similarly unalterable about a person

an MBTI type is a very broad thing though

I'll never be a people person, no matter how much I grow

I feel as if a sufficiently naive person visiting a palm reader would say something similar.

my 5 month old baby is obiousvly not a people person

@༺པརབྱར།བསངཇ༻ you are not coming at this the right way

you're trying to debunk

all I can say to what you say is "I guess?"

@fallot Look, I'm not trying to poo on the MBTI. I'm just not sure that its results are as immutable as you claim.

yes I understand, I dont mind if you do that anyway

what I said is, if the results are mutable

the whole thing is fundamentally worthless, nonexistent

Then I misunderstood.

Fallot but address this

I'll never be a people person, but I see the value in people skills and work to develop them because it seems like a weakness in myself

Falsification is valid.

yes but you're missing the whole point and value of it

there are many things in life we simply take for granted

to which you will never apply this level of scrutiny

trust your intuition

you are dodging

do it, and see what you think

oh come on.

I already told you

that I can give you nothing

so what can I dodge?

what am I to do with myself? I can't decide. Should we be counter signalling nazi's when they are probably inevitable regardless of any effort? Are they just inevitble development of lower class right wing aingst?

@UOC I dont understand what to address

don't "counter signal" just don't be a nazi

You said: "there are many things in life we simply take for granted. to which you will never apply this level of scrutiny"

Be that as it may, such statements are dodges.

again, you missed the point

I started out saying, I can offer you nothing

then you said "falsification is valid", of course its valid

@charles watson "Are they just inevitble development of lower class right wing aingst?"

who is questioning its validity?

Interesting question.

all I said is it has value

MBTI that is

but its subjective, so you wont be able to see for yourself until you get into it a bit

what's counter-signaling? am I doing that?

I can't "show you" anything beyond that

You said: "you are not coming at this the right way."

I'm just wondering how to answer MBTI questions accurately

I assume that "this" is an attempt to find out more about the subject

as your starting point is "this isn't valid"

and mine is "I can't make you think any different from that"

@charles watson It seems that WN1.0 appeals to those who missed out on it the first time around. It may also appeal because it's simple. Simple messages for simple people.

say I have taken the test, investigated the type description and found the information to be inaccurate. What then?

then I imagine you will confirm your opinions

but insights I have gained through MBTI remain

so I will retain mine

its impossible to "disprove" MBTI to me

it can only be refined

a natural democratic result. You give the proles power in society, there understanding of a greater order is there, but limited

on the other hand

maybe you will find the information

not to be "accurate"

Democracy is death.

but to be insightful, valuable

(also accurate)

It would appear that if both of our findings can be correct then that poses as issue for MBTI

yeah, sure

while you could be a number of types, INTPs are those with this level of skepticism

a problem that assumes consistency is a pre-requisite for validity

generally

I think its pretty much a given you are an INTx

INTJ's = MasterRace

is the truth not true if it isn't confirmable?

bring a wide enough net to an area in which fish are known to congregate and I am sure you will catch something

but why throw stones from outside

when you could see for yourself

come in

Personally, I don't like being quantified by some test.

like an IQ test?

all these criticisms are resting on unstated assumptions. You guys seem to be differing on what you think the test is supposed to reveal

I would caution against assuming the experience of others in conversation.

tests are reconition of pattern, not the whole

well I mean

you could just tell me

*recognition

I will assume away in good faith

until proven otherwise

@༺པརབྱར།བསངཇ༻ , after all that buddy you've GOT to take the test

@charles watson This could explain why Asians score so high on IQ tests but act like robots without inspiration.

http://jupiter-34.appspot.com/

relinked for convenience.

and cheating on tests also

I have taken these tests and investigated these types only to find the results wanting

there's a lot of issues with most of the stuff online

let me be your guide, if you end up in the same spot

so be it

that's the worst that could happen anyway

the computer tests are aparently dubious

My mother paid a professional to administer an MBTI test when I was 13.

useless

testing 13 year olds wouldn't even be in-universe ethical

I have my own ideas about that but

What possessed her?

to do such a thing

it was popular among business types

are you an upper middle class striver sort of family?

either that or asian

I am Laotian.

of chinese descent?

ummm I do believe so yes.

did they leave Laos around 1975?

That period of my family's history is fog to me but it must have been around that time.

there's your answer I guess

tiger mom

Crouching tiger mom in my case kek

fallot what do you think about birth order

I've been thinking about that recently

I think its important but there may be some other hidden factor

compounding the matter