Yes i have 1984 on audio book

Cultural Marxism is from collectivism

Okay well fine

Which is from modern liberalism

if we're ignore

That's untrue dude

most liberals are opposed to marx

it's why leftists always clash with the center in the democrats

And dude no one who holds these ideas calls themselve post modern marxists

Classical and modern liberals aren't the same

that was jordan peterson

Are you using "liberal" to refer to extremist-yet-non-anarchist libertarians, or the so-called "anarcho-communists"?

Neither are Neolibs

I was refering to people who hold most liberal values

wait no nvm

I was probably refering more to neoliberalism and it's predecessors

@Somedudewithaname do you know what the Frankfurt School is

Yeah I read some of them.

There whatever.

Nothing to interesting honestly.

that's what people are usually referring to when they say Cultural Marxism

Yea

Yes that super famous and important school.

Who most people can't name a single member off.

of.

I can just name Adorno and Horkheimer off the top of my head

a lot of the time it's connected to jew theories

Ah yes.

Let's not go there please/

I can't handle it today

Don't worry we aren't natsocs

You can have problems with critical theory i get it

Who are fixated on zee jews

natsocs?

nazis

oh

I got it

my b

i got used to calling them ethnic nationalists

maybe im too nice

Tbh if zionism is destroyed then the Jewish Question would finally be solved

Oh boy.

They would go back to just being another passive folk and the sheep-jews (lower-rankin' k1kes) would probably break free.

Ethnonationalism does not involve the ethnic cleansing that natsocs did lol

How would it not?

non-orthodox jews are going to disappear in this country anyway

It seems like the most logical conclusion

the logical solution is not to have open borders

We don't though...

ok but what would you do with the people already here

^^^^

That's the issue we're mostly concerned about

As in no mass immigration

But USA is fucked with that

Idk man the USA is doing fine economically

so is most of the world

Japan is 98.7% Japanese though lmao

We have lower disease, crime, and war than ever before

So?

It' also has it's own issues.

I'm just saying USA can't be an ethnostate at all

While Japan can

Obviously not.

We never were...

we have diffrent ethnicity's since the beginning

and why would you even want one?

What benefit do you get?

I don't

But you could talk to Mord who does

A muttstate can't work

Over in glorious Maine (my home state), the 93.5%-ish white population is slowly being overriden by mutt post-2004 zoomers

People fear mass immigration because their culture will disappear

Which american culture?

I doubt that's going to happen

America is the borg

honestly

we assimilate like no one else

That is what they claim

everyone comes here and prays to mcdonalds

this is america

merica

They believe that tradition connects people the most

We're a 200 year old country

our tradition has literally been we hate tradition

Assimilation of other cultures creates America

well hang on

Captialism is america honeslty

nobility was never really traditional to America

every immigrant that comes and assimilates is an American

As long as we aren't Sweden

idc

the American Revolution didn't upheave society all that much for a while

I'm sure someone is gonna argue with us about this at some point

this is the right server

wouldn't be right without it

We have all sorts of people here

Even social conservatives lol

I never kept up with the new right wing termenology

it always hurts my head

do you mean conservative socialists

DO you really?

Social conservatives believe in the government imposing immoral society practices

Basically gov regulating tradition

weird.

Like burning the flag

I never understood why someone would want the goverment to impose tradition on them..

They would want it illegal

Yeah that's a lot of people though.

this is america we got some weird ideas.

But hate speech is free speech

So flag burning is not illegal

Neither is being politically incorrect

For now

they'll never be able to make that illegal

I was hoping to debate on ethnostates, any takers?

there's no way to interpret the first amendment to allow banning hate speech

Japan?

Go ahead, though I'm probably not going to participate, simply because I'm not very educated.

@Somedudewithaname it depends on history and demographics

imo

What do you mean

?

the US could never be an ethnostate without destroying itself, but Europe or Japan could

especially Eastern Europe

Japan is one

yeah Japan is something like 97% ethnic Japanese

You don't mean rusia do you?

the rest are Koreans mostly

and some whites

And do you think these were forcible or just becase no one moved there

I think a lot of these Eastern Euro countries that people point to as paragons of ethnonationalism and defense against Islam probably wouldn't have gotten much immigration either way

I don't know why you would go to Poland or Hungary when you can go to Germany

I have a hard time understanding any benefit in an ethno state

but since those countries are still almost entirely the ethnic group they're named after they could definitely implement policies to keep that going

Oh like yeah they could

but i wanted to debate wheter it would be benefical on a social level or even an ethical level

Ping Mord

Whose mord get him in here

He would be happy to say why lol

I need this in my life

I enjoy pain.

imo there's nothing unethical about a nation historically built around native ethnic groups preserving that status

or unbeneficial considering that the political institutions of those countries are built around that system

Eh I guess you could make an argument it's morally neutral depending on the reasons for it

@Mord This guy wants to know what is beneficial about an ethnostate and why there should be one

Jesus christ this guy scares me already lol

He is probably asleep

@EzraOldenstein bring it

Like I should be

bring what

Lets argue why god is trash

why do you think God is trash

God isnt "trash" there is nothing to argue

You being edgy and faggoty is an argument

Lol okay we should set some actual debate topics

DO you think states should be organized around religion?

Do you think god is the locus of all morality?

DO you think religion is a net benefit to society?

I was just being edgy lol but nah I want to actually debate

The last 2 questions are pretty obvious

Hello

Oh shit here we go

MOrb why is an ethno shit benefical to society?

Why do you want one?

@Mord they needed your white boy autism

How does it even benefit you?

You identify as a theocrat ezra

You mean why do we need ethnic nationalism?

your in no position to judge anyones opinion.

Sure lets go with that/

@Somedudewithaname the fuck are you talking about

mord is white and autistic
i am italian and autistic

im not judging anybody

Sigh.

I am epic and autistic

I'm to leftist to do this shit lol

Ethnic nationalism serves as a framework for being able to have a common culture, background, and in some cases experiences. lt connects those people in a nation. People tend to naturally be collective, and ethnic nationalism grows on that.

Okay but what makes you think a common idenity needs to rest on the basis of race?

WHy couldn't some other idenity serve the same function?

Civic nationalism does not work because you will inevitably have identity politics where people will vote for policies that benefit them.

And why do we even need to value collectives?

Isn't the nature of polotics to vote in self intrest?

Unless your agianst democracy?

Because it creates a homogenous nation of one culture and one nation

Why does that matter?

Precisely, the nature of politics is to vote in self interest as well as those you share common values, culture, backgrounds, and race as you.

I can say it's possible to vote with those who share common values, but wouldn't it be of most benefit to have a sysem that allows most people into yuor collective?

THat way you have more resources pooled together?

Not necessarily, that is basically civic nationalism.

Why value nationalism over globalism?

How would immigrants from a different background support a common background

If Civic Nationalism does not work why has there not been a modern western ethnostate ? @Mord

It seems like the later would be in the best intest of all?

WE as a global collective are capable of much more than isloated nations/

Japan is a modern day ethnostate @Outboarduniform

western

Japan is like 97% Japanese

@Mord japan also has stagnant birth rates and their children are socially inept

Oh l apologize

@Somedudewithaname how would the global collective respond to the needs of individual people

I would use it as an argument against ethnostates tbh

Same way we do now.

nationstates are far better at responding to their people's needs than any global collective could

Unfortunately is that really true?

@Outboarduniform the stagnant birthrates are a new phenomenon within the last 30 years or so, last l checked.

Maybe more developed nation states but lots of countries would benefit from more global involvement

the world is also far too disunited for a global collective to adequately represent it

and that is not an argument to import people who do not share Japanese culture, values, or anything else that makes someone Japanese

Well obviously you can find change when you go back decades @Mord

and we would benefit from having stronger trading partners in currently struggling countries

Why would Japan be un able to assimilate like America?

And there is no argument calling for the importation of people into Japan

I mean we did it just fine.

@Somedudewithaname let me ask you something, and l want you to answer it honestly.

Sure

civnat doesn't work well because people with their own nationalism will experience culture shock in a different country unless they adapt

First generation immigrants will never truly integrate

Their children, however, will

Lol yes they do

@Hadou Divinity Mercurius of course

where have you been?

this is what we've seen in the past

but long-term they'll assimilate

Indeed

Would you find any problem with any european country to say that, for example "Poland is for Polish people", or "France is for French people". What is wrong with that

Hell Andrew Carnegie.

Ugh well I'm very mixed on this////

@Mord depends on your definition of polish and French

Well partly wat out boarding uniform says

@Somedudewithaname there are exceptions, and Scotland and America aren't all that distant culturally

There are tons of french citizens who are african

Polish and French people who have roots dated back at least 100 years @Outboarduniform

but if you look at Irish-Americans, they certainly struggled with assimilation in the beginning

the same with Italians

France has a ton of african citizens from the colonial era

who consider themselves french

But they are not French @Somedudewithaname

and played for the french team

@Mord how do you define French and Polish people though

they think they are.

would Polish Jews who've been there longer than 100 years be Polish

@Mord what makes someone who’s family has been in Poland for 30 years any less deserving of living in Poland than the ones who have been there for 100 years

l used it as an example, l don't want to argue semantics on it

Well I don't mean to gang up on you

And if you feel overwhelmed lmk lol

I think that the example itself is flawed though

So far you've shown common identiy to be what unifies a nation

what's a French person? Before the French government essentially committed linguicide there were many different minority groups in France

but you haven't proven where race matters in all this

The point is, what is wrong with a nation wanting to keep to themselves and unite their people as one culture, ethnicity, identity, religion if any, etc..