I think religion is that compelling...

You only need evidence to prove positive claims, not to disprove them

biological.....concesious............its the same thing

I think the desire to believe in something greater is ingrained in humanity. Thats why Nietzsche said that with the death of god, humanity needs to find it's own purpose

*instict

consciousness is not the same as instinct

I belive its ingrained in humans because the birds believe in the rain god....

what makes you think the birds believe in the rain god?

but how do you know the birds believe in a rain god

perhaps is the god of harvest?

i dont know it

again

rain = worms = food

where does god come into that

maybe birds just believe in rain

lol

again, are birds even capable of believing

sorry, trying to flesh this out for myself

how can we prove that birds know the rain is what causes the worms to rise?

...thanks for being cool through the process >.<

maybe they just take advantage of the situation

or maybe they just learned to associate the rain with there being more worms

Im going to say the bird's parents were taught how to follow rains....

yeah and there is no need for belief for that to be true

there is no evidence that birds teach each other things

bird parents do not teach a fledgling to fly

wait don't hunting dogs teach their young how to hunt?

& due to a lack of a language to properly literate the conecpt, it isconcived as a religious rule.........not so much we do this because there are worms, but because we do this because my ancestors did it.....

Birds dont have a concept of behavior

they know parents, self, children, and others

knowledge is not passed down

it is through the flock

but the flock does not teach

the flock is there for instinctual reasons

ofc not the same way we pass down

ya, i see religion in that

I dunno, maybe there are natural learned behaviors but where does religion come into play what so ever?

they are performing rituals they dont understand for a greater good

religion requires belief in a god or gods, there is no way to prove that birds believe in a god or gods, let alone if they can even conceptualize what a god is

Well no, they are learning behaviors because they see what works, and the greatest good to them is what ever keeps them alive

eric your starting to get it

the greatest good = religion

I didn't say that

i did

I don't follow that logic

religion = prrof of concept?

?

belief in a greatest good could be considered religion

but that requires belief

but you can't even say that there is belief

pna get it!

so what do you think, am i crazy.???

im not talking about birds

anyways, great convo guys, thanks for entertaining me 😃

with people sure, but with instinctive animals no way

again, religion and belief are purly human conceptions

JPB?

Heirichys are present in lobsters?

but heirarchies aren't beliefs

heirarchies are social status

and social species have been around for millenia

^

you cannot say there are heriarchies in sponges

there are hierarchies in religion, there's no religion in hierarchies

heirarchies require a belief.....something is better than something else.....

no they don't

no heriarchies do not require belief

'splain

hierarchies are just a way of ranking one thing as better than another, but you don't need belief for that

you are a small wolf, there are other wolves but they are all larger

therefore you are bottom wolf

no belief necessary

Eric - you contradicted yourself......you need to believe one thing is better than the other.....

there is no belief behind knowing one is better than another

ahhh but the female wolf has to choose who to mate with

you don't "believe" it, you just behave within the constructs of the hierarchy

there is a belif there

how about a 200m race

5 people run it and they all come in different places

this is a heirarchy

you have to be capable of complex thought to be capable of belief

is it the silkiest coat.........the biggst? the stealthiest.........but thats what makes us different.....the values we choose

animals dont necessarily choose

but lobsters don't choose those values, they just naturally behave within that structure

they instinctually go for whoever is at the top of the heirarchy

foxes choose looks over pack benifits, husky's choose thick coats......

the lobster isn't thinking "i'm gonna mate with the biggest lobster," it's just naturally and instinctively choosing to mate with whatever has the greatest chance for successful procreation

hyenas choose jaw strenghth over running!

boom

but those thick coats aren't chosen because they believe anything, they just choose them because they instinctively are attracted to thicker coats

hyenas dont need to run

they rely on packs and strong jaws to get a kill

hyenas are instinctively attracted to hyenas with tougher jaws, no belief required

there is a reason hyenas have 10x the jaw strenght, but run slower than most dog species

because of evolution

it would be like saying cheetahs choose speed over strength

they don't choose those things, it just happens that the ones that survived the game of life had those qualities

because momma hyena didnt run & grandpa neither,,,,,,

they dont choose it, it's the attribute they find most appealing

or the attribute that keeps them alive

exactly & those are religion

no because there is no belief behind it

are you famuilar w/ malaria?

mal = bad, aria = air

bad air

thats etomology

we still diagnose ppl w/ 'bad air'

so what?

i fail to see the connection

because when malria came into common knowedge, that was the best way to describe it

and?

what does that have to do with religion?

its not bad air

and a jellyfish isn't actually a fish

you are arguing semantics

its bacteria/virus within the moist air cauing illness

is it not a religios belif that if you muck through the swamp you will fall victim the the bad air?

no

same idea....

no?

no its not

religion is an action you perform without fully understanding why

jelly fish is actually jelly

no its not

there are devils in the swamp?

that's a symptom of religion, not a factor of it

religion is the belief in gods or god

*demons?

yeah, and people are capable of believing in things like that, animals are not

if an animal falls ill, does it believe demons have infected it?

I disagree, the bird has the same thought.......the demons have poisioned the lake....

birds dont think

evidence?

bids think because choice

the statement that birds believe in the supernatural is an extraordinary claim that has to be proven

no they dont

birds do not think

they act on instinct

eric....fair enough, just expressing opins here, & not hard fafts

a bird doesn't go, I'm going to wake up in the morning and sing, then I'll get some food and sing some more

but those opinions should be based in fact

*why my keyboard getting smaller >.<

fair enough

have you been drinking?

im looking for input more than proving myself right

i have

I hate alcohol lol

....just cracked #4

New Belgium trple

honestly you guys have beenb great

👌

all discussion, no hate

that's because we're all conservatives who don't yell at each other xD

wait, who said anything about being conservative

I just assumed

ya...wai....wha

maybe not then lol

im nt a commie.....if that makes me conservtive

I'm a purple haired SJW that identifies as a toaster and youve just triggered me

Oh, speaking of which who has seen Sh0e's new video

it's amazing

meh, not a shoe fan

she talks about the feminists who believe being straight is a choice

i stopped watching her and armoured back in the whole candid debaucle

that wasn't nearly enough reason for me to stop

candid debaucle? please do tell

basically candid paid them to do sponsorships

shappy, ruby, pooly, Jordainy

but it turned out candid has been doing some really shady shit

shoe's mom is hot

there was a social media app that was all about free speech and they gave paid sponsorships to those who would talk good things

oh

turns out candid was censoring and stuff

i memeber

but armoured and shoe defended it

candid is a company?

candid is no more i think

yeah but they just didn't do enough research and they apologized for it later so whatever

yeah it died

I had been losing interest in Armoured at the time anyway

and I didn't care for shoe to begin with, although I love her patriarchy skit with the Trump mask

I love them all lol

Not a big fan of TJ Kirk though

I was when I was in high school

I have a friend who looks exactly like him

lmao poor guy 😛

lol he's a gun loving texan so very different

i dont have much animosity for TJ though

a lot of channels I just grew out of

I didn't like how TJ was basically cynical about everything

TJ red pilled my on micro penises

TJ vs Tommy was epic >.<

didn't see that

more like DP vs Tommy

I remember when TJ did a live stream and one of his friends cut his hand deep enough they had to call the police

Dam

ya know nothing like bananna clips to spuce up a vid >.<

ambulance

hot oil clip

also, looks like the big man is online

I called in yesterday

yeah? I think i may have missed your call

I came in late

I only watch, matt is cool, blonde is psycho >.<

Yeah my call was somewhat early on

speaking of yesterday, where can i find yesterdays stream?

blonde is hilarious

Blonde read one of my jokes

I think he deletes them after

the call-in stream isn't put on youtube

oh

I wish lol

but you can watch all the streams on other streaming sites

oh well

google play, soundcloud, stitcher

What if Matt is watching our conversation right now

like the NSA

good

notice me senpai

MATT AND I ONCE MADE LOVE

notice me Matt, I'm naked

great you scared him off

but not me 😉

maybe everyone in the discord is watching our conversation

Matt and I once made love in the recording studio. He can really get his mouth on that microphone if you know what I mean

well shite, maybe more than blonde will mispronounce my username

I did my first superchat on sunday and blonde struggled

why aren't nicknames allowed on the server?

dunno

someone needs to change their name to Poon

maybe everyone should

Poonkotus

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/383403456465207296/456205533146513429/AAAAHHHH.gif

I feel like most people here are liberal

How the left claimed the word liberal when they have a track record of regulating everything is beyond me

Classical liberals.

I mean

No

Just liberals

Classical conservative would just be a fundamentalist no?

Classical liberals as in for liberty.

I understand

But that's literally liberal

I was a democrat in the 90s under clinton. In voice only because I wasn't old enough to vote, but I remember being a full on anarchist, and told that it was the ideals of my party to have the government leave me the hell alone

back then the churchy republicans where the finger wagglers that insisted what you should and shouldn't do. That's where the term Liberal came from

The socialists were always in the Democrat wing, but they were a fringe voice up until Barack rose to power. But when the Democrats turned full on authoritarian, the term "Liberal" was co-opted into the lexicon

I understand the historical context

But they just changed

They clearly aren't liberal anymore

I was dumb enough to vote for Obama. Now I’m reformed.