@Gonzo ek het so verneem, ek spot maar net so bietjie. Maar jy kannie stry dat die DA links is nie

Die ANC is net verder links

En die EFF nog verder

Daai is meer kans vat aa wat dit 'n oplossing is

My oplossing is om kleiner partye groter te maak wat actually veg vir minderheids regte. Heel eenvoudig.

Dis die probleem met Suid Afrika. Suid Afrikaners is bereid om teen hulle beginsels te stem, net omdat hulle glo dis die enigste oplossing teen die ANC. In ander lande kry mens dit nie

Jip, geloof is laag...

Kom voice toe

Ja ons het n demokrasie, so jy will n demokrasie wat die swart meerderheid verkies uitruil vir nog demokrasie wat nou ook die swart meerderheid verkies? Kan ons tog 'n beter plan he as dit, om weg te kom van 'n demokrasie af, sodat almal gelyk kan wees, maak nie saak wat die meerderheid voel nie?

GOSA vs SAPS Summary

Judgement handed down:

1) it is directed that SAPS are prohibited from any plan of action to collect surrendered firearms
2) this application is postponed to the normal roll
3) that by declaratory order of court the periods in 24 etc of the Act may be extended for people to apply on good cause shown
4) The Feb 2016 directive is withdrawn
5) the IT system of CFR must be repaired to accept late renewals
6) SAPS is ordered to issue a directive that the IT system be repaired
7) Any late renewal apps must show good cause
8)any applicant shall be deemed to be in lawful possession

@Sheamus Ek sal se dit is juis die skelm rond voeter om terug te kry wat die probleem is. Hoekom kan ons nie net reguit na die eindpunt toe gaan nie en net ons waardes behou? Is ons waardes so vikeerd dat ons eintlik onderhand moet speel en rond voeter met risks? Dit voel rerig skelm as ek nou rerig eerlik is met jou. Probeer jou nie sleg se nie, net ek dink klink soos 'n kak plan. En COPE is 'n mors van tyd in my opinie, lekota is 'n kommie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA3kG_Z9c2M

http://www.politicsweb.co.za/politics/nhi-pilot-project-fails-at-elim-district-hospital-

http://www.politicsweb.co.za/documents/the-da-is-completely-committed-to-bbbee--mmusi-mai

For all those who think the DA is the solution to SA's problems ☝

@Gonzo I fully agree with you that Afrikaners should not be running away. Our place is on the Southern tip of Africa, and always has been. I just think that party politics are not the solution to the problems we face. I agree with you that the DA govern better than the ANC ever could, but in the end, their policies are just as discriminatory as the ANC's policies. If only Afrikaners could for once stand together and make a plan for our future, that would be a major step in the right direction. I still believe the best solution would be secession and our own Volkstaat, but we need to pull together in order to accomplish something like that. A referendum would then be needed, and we would need to decide on which area would be suitable for something like that. However, I think most Afrikaners are too comfortable with their current circumstances, and wouldn't want to move to another territory and leave everything behind (which is understandable). It is a complex situation.

I agree that would be a good start, but even if the Western Cape consists out of 80% Afrikaners, we would still be under the socialist policies of the government of South Africa. The ultimate solution has to be a separate Afrikaner state.

Yes true, but my point is, even if we elect our own political party to govern the province, we would still be required to operate within the South African constitution, and we would also still be forced to apply the socialist policies of the South African government.

We would still be paying tax for NHI for instance

But we would still be paying social taxes for others. The government would still have the capacity to redistribute portions of our taxes to other people. And if the constitution were to be changed to allow for Land expropriation without compensation for instance, we would still be affected, because we would still be part of South Africa. The only way to sidestep all of these issues, is to secede from South Africa, and form our own Volkstaat

Pretty sure people will go to the cape almost without hesitation, if there is property for homes they actually can afford and work for them to do. Voting DA, that is in full support of BEE, and looking to appeal to the black majority through identity politics, is not going to make that happen. The idea to gather us there in the Cape is a good idea, but to get everyone to vote DA is not. Majority want to punish them for pushing identity politics and wanting to defend BEE, to let them know we don't like to get played. Take a moment to reflect on the idiots that complain about the ANC, but keep voting ANC. Why are we to be like them? Should we not lead by example and actually stop supporting the fruitful works of evil? After all, real leadership is what is lacking.

http://praag.co.za/?p=45030

@Gonzo fair enough, but weren't you pushing to vote DA last night, or have you given up on that argument now?

I see the DA vote as stability for a while,not an end solution. Stopping corruption and having services delivered to people is a start,and the DA is doing that in WC, and in parts in the EC,so they at least do their work.

@Gonzo The picture on the left is the ANC, and the picture on the right is the DA

Newer small parties can be formed lol, dude, what makes you think the DA, once in power will not use the same scare tactics the ANC is using? We see the ANC telling masses vote ANC or the boere will take over again. If the DA is starting to play the same game as the ANC, don't you expect to see the DA saying vote DA or the ANC takes over again? They are playing the same game... Small parties afterwards mean nothing. The DA is literally sugarcoating the actual problem here. As for COPE, yeah what lekota says really sounds good, especially if you are a boer, but he openly acknowledges he is still ANC. A good tree produces good fruit, a corrupt tree produces corrupt fruit. A good tree cannot produce corrupt fruit and neither can a corrupt tree produce good fruit. If lekota is loyal to ANC, and the ANC is measured by its fruitful works, then it's obvious what COPE is. As for VF, I'll have to look more into it, i haven't really looked much into them, but i don't have an opinion on them at the moment. But i still have a problem with your method of reasoning, to support the fruitful works of evil for your own selfish desires. Just don't, focus your strategy towards getting everyone in the cape, then we can say stuff you and your shitty politics, we will do our own thing, and then we can get out of this Democratic rule and bring back the rule of law that is above the rule of lowly man. This methodical scheming and deception you suggest is only giving more power and legitimacy to the problem, which doesn't allow us to solve the root cause, and instead forces us to treat the symptoms.

@TruthCanary that picture is perfect by the way lol 👌

I'm not going to tell you who to vote for, only a politician will do that, and I'm no politician. But i am trying to reason with you, so that you can be more reasonable about your choices. You value your vote in a democracy, that value is your investment in a democracy, and like any business, investment drives the growth and legitimacy of that business. Politics is business as usual, dont forget that. Vote with your wallet people will say, and if all your options are not worth your money, don't waste your money. Save it, and then invest in something else.

The DA does really good with their maintenance and governance, i get that's why you would prefer them, but it's in their best interest to make you dependent on them, but why depend on them, why depend on politics even. We have a rule of law that makes us all equal given to us by our creator, and politics really only is a means to wiggle our way out of that rule of law, to justify inequality, by feeding on our prejudices and making us dependent on our overlords to defend us from righteous judgement. Why be dependent, why not be independent? Why not steer away from the distraction of politics and the dependency of a government, and look toward independence from a government?
🤔

The idea that we ought to come together in the Cape is a great idea me thinks, we can just not play the political game and not invest in it, and say we want out of that political game and return to a rule of law that is intended to keep the unrighteous out, and away, and that vote can be better invested in our community and what we ought to prioritize. That's how i see it personally. We should be independent from a government, hence whatever government we do put together will be limited and small, and will face the judgement of the people if they so decide to pave a way to hell with their good intentions to make us dependent on them.

My last words on this topic is this. The road to the hell is paved with good intentions. I don't think you are a bad person, i think you mean well, obviously. But you are helping to pave the way forward to hell, and i just want you to see it for what it is, to understand what that means when i say, the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Give it some thought, look at this globalist democratic agenda, listen to the the shit they say, you can't deny they mean well, but you can see the results there of is bringing the world closer to hell... Just recognize the truth, and be reasonable about it.

We are not as independent as you may think we are, we may support the means and ideas of independence, but in fact we are very divided preventing us from actually being independent, and the division now makes us dependent on our saviour the DA, that will unite different perceptions and beliefs, and promise to bring peace... There is a principle that already dictates the way this unfolds... Orania is independent, we who are not in Orania or our own version of paradise, we are not independent. Hence why i say, good idea to come together. Orania didn't come into existence by playing shady political games, they recognised the truth, came together and made a plan, and acted out accordingly. We can do the same thing, but this distraction of politics is just that, a distraction.

The DA support BEE... And they think we who are white are too privileged. Why would they support your idea, and if they do, what makes you think they will keep the majority vote?

Again, i do see where you are coming from, i really do... But they are the ANC lite only because they don't hold majority power, and if they get into power, they will become the ANC.

Yes and it will reflect poorly on the DA, and the majority will compell them to do something about it, because democracy, and if they don't, the ANC just says, told you so, the EFF says told you so, BLF says told you so... And then you will realize the hell that was paved.

Sorry man, I know you mean well, and i just really can't keep going in circles. Let me know when you want to talk about independence from a democratic rule, a plan of action, not some shady strategy to get back at the ANC. This just sounds like cutting off your own nose to spite your own face.

Ditsem! @Sheamus, you just advanced to level 12!

The US is not a democracy, in spite of the lie that you keep hearing from their democrats. I agree, dividing us up into self governed states is a better idea, it's a step up, but will need to make the necessary adjustments to our constitution for that i believe, which requires a particular large vote in support. It will probably be easier to just get together somewhere, and secede from the country through legal means, without really offending or forcing the rest of the country to follow the dictation of the minority, and then establish ourselves independently like Orania. Less risk that way, they did it and look at them, they materialized it, and we need to follow in their footsteps, and go in the same direction, if we intend to have what they have.

My bad then, I apologise. Probably not the best example to make. I do admit that it was based off of an assumption and here i am, made an ass over it 😅 but okay, they still made it happen without playing shady politics, just got it done.

Personally I think secession will be necessary to avoid the shift in power that state will achieve to expropriate private property. Its a pity, i genuinely thought Orania seceded, maybe it was their own currency that mislead my understanding, i made the mistake of judging on appearance. Lol but as such I'll reinforce righteous judgement. Thank you for correcting me @Gonzo

https://www.facebook.com/eNCAnews/videos/1322887927847869/

@Gonzo @Sheamus I must say, as an American who has been following the situation in SA for a year or so (and I am of course by no means an expert), I must say that you both make fantastic points and arguments that I think are worth deep consideration. I would ask the gentleman who seems to be in favor of supporting the DA, albeit as a first step/temporary solution, that, lets say Afrikanners do, somehow, migrate/reproduce enmass in the Western Cape; I hear the ANC is attempting to flood the province with its members/supporters; even if this is not true, what's to say that mass amounts of blacks would not flood into the WC and simply takeover from the whites? Are invidivual provinces in SA allowed to have their own "immigration systems". Enjoying the discussion immensley fellows! 😃

@Gonzo The federal state solution is the easiest short term solution, but will still kill us in the long run. Any provincial law will have to be subject to the current constitution, which is already a product of bs ideas. The state can also pass laws that counter or circumvent any provincial law that you would want to enact so you are still at the mercy of the MAJORITY. Even if we seceded to a federal type state, whites are still only 8%. In a democracy, you will still be subject to the mob which means (in the case of the cape) you'll just be ruled by mongrels in stead of blacks.

Now here's the kicker: This is going to happen. Because there is already 1 and a half generation that have been conditioned to accept the mongrel as an equal because they mostly speak our language and have adopted our customs and habits to alarge degree. Your children will be further conditioned and socialised at school to assimilate through proximity and the school system while the (((media))) conditions them to think mescegenation is acceptable, cool or preferable.

So yes, you might win for one generation, but your children and granchildren will not survive.

@$P!KY\/!k!NG We need a monarchy, democracy is a false god.

@$P!KY\/!k!NG And because peaple are desperate for a solution they will think this is a godsend when really it is a delayed death warrant.

@HoppeanSnake_ZA I agree half and half. I believe in volksraad. A council of men from your own people. Voting is reserved for those who pay taxes and have children and have served the nation. IQ tests and genetic tests should be mandatory to ensure that only the best have a say in the future of the NATION. The council and any state official that is guilty of corruption should be seen as betraying the trust vested in them by the volk and therefore are traitors to the volk. Death must be swift. Serving on the council must be a burden. A terrifying burden.

@Klipkop (Clip-Cop)

You want this party to rule?

@Gonzo Is the envisioned future according to these youth posters saving our culture?

@Gonzo lol you get used to it, he is just obsessed with race like the liberal left are. If only [insert race] could be done away with, all problems would be solved. As if there aren't bigger and more concerning problems that go deeper than skin.

@Gonzo Okay correct me if I'm wrong. Your plan is for all the afrikaners to give our votes to the (((DA))) to remove the (((ANC)))? Then we all move to a certain province to become the majority ruled by the (((DA))). Then we ask the (((DA))) if we can have a federal type state where we have more control over governmental systems so that we can take power away from the (((DA)))? Then once we have our own party, we let the free(mason) market rule through its networks?

And the ultimate end goal is saving our culture?

Much better argument that

@Gonzo Did I miss anything?

@Sheamus Race is deeper than skin 🤔

Not as deep as ideas and values that make up our culture. Race is too shallow of an argument to make honestly. You can keep your racial opinion, it doesn't bother me because i have no intention to force you to stray from familiarity, which even I would prefer, but your loyalty should be deeper than the superficial color you obsess over.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/469490581899575297/472846407766769665/53177.png

How bout that superficial colour again?

Lol what is the argument there exactly?

@Sheamus well the "truth" of your statement rests on the notion that race is only skin deep which is obviously false. The notion that the ideas, values and culture of a people are more important than the physical genetic existence of that people that embody and created said values ideas culture is just....fuck.

@$P!KY\/!k!NG To put it as simply as I can put it would be to say that the corn flakes are more valuable than the continued ability to grow corn.

@$P!KY\/!k!NG lol my truth rests on reality. If I hypothetically wanted to procreate with an actual animal, it's impossible to do naturally, and if forced genetically, the reproductive system is then disabled for the offspring. To me that is a clear sign of my creators disapproval. Same goes with inbreeding, penalties are incurred. Fact is, different races of human beings can reproduce naturally without being forced through genetic modifications to work, and even by natural procreation, there is no penalty to prohibit further procreation. Therefore as per the creators command to be fruitful and multiply, i see no problem here, and this is fact and reality. Your propaganda doesn't say much to prove much.

Again, i have no problem with your preference and selfish desire, because even myself have the very same selfish desire to have my children look like me, this is very understandable, and obviously you would use whatever biased information/propaganda to justify your selfish desire. However, you serve only your selfish desire, and not a will greater than your own selfish desire. So long as you don't push your propaganda as God's will, or try use Christian literature to justify your propaganda, i really don't care about your personal selfish desires.

@Sheamus Deut 23:3 answer that.

@Gonzo South Africa

Eastern Cape

@$P!KY\/!k!NG already have in previous argument, just because you don't accept the response, does not mean i have not answered it. Again, we have different values, different understanding, and our loyalties serve different rulers.

@Sheamus You didn't have a scriptural response.

I asked for two witnesses as scripture dictates. I gave you multiple witnesses throughout the scripture. You gave me some spiritual mongrel nonsense that doesn't exist in scripture and then gave me two verses by paul. Only one witness.

One witness taken out of context I might add.

Anyone interes in seeing the slaughter can scroll up to the top of the theology thread.

@Gonzo I don't vote. I wait.

@$P!KY\/!k!NG actually i did, but your reaction to it was a questionable witness, so you wrote it off.. I'm not going to rehearse this again, as I've said, i know where your loyalties lie, i know who you really serve, there is no other point to make here, you openly betrayed the greatest commandment proudly, and the second great commandment. So I'm content leaving this argument as resolved. You want to serve two different masters, i trust you understand the implication there of.

@Gonzo Secession. But a nation state. It won't be had without conflict. And without the will to accept the inevitable conflict you will be stuck in a multiracial multicultural liberal democracy with a smaller landmass and a smaller budget. And that's if you can convince the (((DA))) to give you more self rule so that you can take power away from them. You're essentially just moving the shackle from the left foot to the right.

@Gonzo War is already here. Look at the bodycount.

War would be inevitable, would be easier to collectively defend a border, than individually defend our properties.

@Sheamus That's the only weakness the cape secessionist movement has. It has the will and common sense to secede but no means to enforce the secession.

You don't start a war, the war is started opposing you. No where are the boere asking to start a war, it's EFF and BLF who are the ones saying land must be taken by force. They are the ones that will start the war.

@Gonzo It wouldn't be wise to explain here. But suffice to say that I and my associates have heard your exact plan before at a volkraad meeting and it is the most practical solution in terms of avoiding conflict. I'm not against it, but it is at best delaying the inevitable. This is by no means a new idea and has been considered years ago.

@Gonzo I didn't say there wasn't a solution in place.

Best plan i can figure is to resolve our issues that divide us. Get all the wealthy business owners to arrange for homes and work in the cape for all of us as a community, that would mean sharing wealth for a greater good. If there are homes (property) and work that side, the trek will begin, and people will have property and economical value to defend. Once there, get armed, I'm sure arms will be provided to us, we have loyalties internationally. Then defend our border until agreement and cease fire is announced and our secession is recognized legally and officially. Then do away with democracy, and return the rule of law. That's just off the top of my head cutting out the bullshit and getting it done.

@Gonzo I hear you man. I hear you loud and clear. It's going to get really bad before it gets better.

Lol it's not a solution, or a cure.. It's a simple band aid.

@Gonzo I hear you and I won't stop you. Hell I'll even throw in my vote to help you. But in the long run...same effect.

@Gonzo Check out front nasionaal. There are plenty of cape secessionist movements.

Everyone is talking but i hear no actual plan.

Ditsem! @Gonzo, you just advanced to level 9!

It's just one idea, and a shady one at that. Shady ideas have a tendency to flop, because people aren't motivated by deception nearly as much as they are by the truth.

@Gonzo Like I said, there are solutions in place but nothing that can be discussed here. And it concerns the boers and our end goal. It doesn't include other peoples.

@Gonzo But like I said I will not stop you. I'll help you even.

Agreed, we need to get together, we need a new trek, totally agree with that. People won't abandon their own property and income to go somewhere where they own no property and have no work though. Nothing to defend.

@Gonzo I hear you. Loud and clear.

The thing is will it be a long term solution? Considering resources.

@Gonzo we're not doing nothing, we're just looking out for the boer's concerns which are long term and the same as it was before. But if the afrikaners want to secede to the cape, I will not stop you at all.

The people concerned about saving their own skin are buggering off abroad. Its really only those who can't, and who have something of worth here to defend that remain. Unfortunately, most would not just pack up and leave to the cape without having anything there, they would rather stay put and take their chances defending their property and their work. This is how divided we are. So unless i have a reason other than saving my own skin to leave my property and work behind to go to the cape, I'm going to stay and take my own chances, and I'm not the only one that feels this way. So unless the wealthy over there can say there is property and work for me that side to defend which would justify me leaving behind what i have here in kzn, i have no valid reason to trek. As far as the DA goes, they are betraying me, and playing the same game the ANC is playing, to remain loyal to the majority voting for them, they would prefer i don't have any chance that side, just like the ANC that is attempting to flood the cape with more blacks with no values and oppose ideas of free market and property ownership. So I'm not convinced the DA has my best interest in mind when they actively support BEE and play the white privilege card. I'll go defend property and the right to rule of law in a heart beat. Not going to be take my chances with shady strategies that sound very risky. I don't trust anyone that sells out their values.

@Gonzo do we have 10-20 years? Do you think the way things are going now are sustainable?

There are always risks in change.

How do you garuntee new jobs for all the people who move to the province. Homes.
And Some are so depended on their current areas they live in.
Buisness owners in Johannesburg or Pretoria?

And if the Cape hits another drought why would the other provinces suport the WC

@Gonzo Bet those yes voters are shitting themselves now ey...

What will it take for the province to become its own country so to say?

The DA is playing the same game, and in a democracy they are subject to the demand of the people, the majority of the people that is. And if they don't give in the to demands of the people, there will be that whole told you so attitude floating around. So 1 term maybe, 5 years is probably going to be the most time you can buy. The majority are demanding for things NOW, so if the DA can't deliver what the ANC promise NOW, they won't have a second term, in fact i wouldn't be surprised if there is an attempt to get them out sooner. I just don't see it realistically happening. I get where you coming from, i get that the theory has some sense to it, but if there is one thing I've observed, it is that the ruling majority do not think or behave like us, they have a very different culture and value system, a different perception of reality, and it is them who hold the majority vote.

There might be a slight possibility that the ANC will prevent this project from happening

Ditsem! @GhostRanger, you just advanced to level 1!

I see. I agree with you, the concept makes sense why it would work.

Anyhoo peeps. It seems that the goals of the boervolk and those of the rest differ in the long term. All I can say is that there have been guards on the wall for many generations. Nobody listened in 1910. Nobody listened in 1992. You're not listening now. I wish you all the best of luck and may you and your families be protected. YHWH bless and keep you. Auf wiedersehen

You know, if the DA was not playing identity politics and throwing around false accusations like white privilege, and opened up to BEE coming to an end, your idea would be worth embracing. Those factors created and maintain inequity, and the gap in the inequity only grows larger, and trust diminishes. I can't support those values and believe that somehow, this will work out in our favor, the minority. Good luck though, can hope you are right about it and maybe you convince others, but i maintain my values and loyalty to bringing back and maintaining equity faithfully, the only true way. Cheers.