#vaxx-discussions (Discord ID: 552285797038948364) in The Ice Wall, page 3
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and other brain defects
whats the proof
I've cited studies already
it depends on what they contain
should I tell you something funny, but worse re: vaccine side effects?
according to drugs.com, you have to go to the poison conrol centeror get medical care if you think you've got an overdose of the yellow fever vaccine
Here's some part that's harsher:
just wtf, how is it possible to get a hallucination after a vaccine?
if i've gotten flu shots and never gotten any side effects or the flu, how does this prove that flu shots hurt people?
hallucinations are gonna be how this specific person's immune system reacts. The cell itself is dead or weak so it can't do anything.
there is a reason why patients need to get individualized before medical treatment
just like that patients react differently to drugs, also applies to vaccines
you seem to be overcomplicating a very simple process
you just have list of what you're intolerant or allergic to, and the person(s) giving it will determine what to do. it's that simple
we've been led to believe that autism is predominantly genetic
but the twin studies they use, have not included the geneXenvironment factor
meaning genes interacting with the environment
while the studies showing GeneXenvironment factor show that autism is epigenetic, not genetic
which could explain the significant increase in autism, change in diagnosis is responsible for just a 56% increase
it went from 1 in 10k to 1 in 36 in the US
in the Netherlands, it's about 1 in 100 or 1 in 50 (possibly overestimation)
air pollution, water pollution and other environmental factors shouldn't be forgotten
not to even forget the influence from birth control pills, which contain hormones
what the hormones do to a fetus' brain is unknown
there has never been an increase in autism, only an increase in diagnosis because of a better understanding of the disorder. that was a poor correlation to make.
I've always expected this to be one argument for the increase
on the associated genes, what are the functions of those genes in the first place?
focusing on environmental factors, even prenatal (depends on what the pregnant mother consumes) is important...
Why are the autism cases so low in Poland, Taiwan, China and the Netherlands?
you are somewhat correct with some disorders being caused by what a mother eats/drinks (for example, too much alcohol) but you have the complete wrong idea. immune system memory is different to consumption, it is passed on to the child for a while but it makes no difference to genes before birth. in fact they go away after a while, that's why kids fall ill often.
genes can mutate
sometimes there are environmental factors mutating the genes
oh and to autism correlation, that wouldn't be a reliable point to prove as not everyone gets diagnosed and there could just be potentially less than other countries, and population is also a factor.
although there is always an average, there is never an exact amount everywhere.
so we need a control group
when it comes to percentage, it's about how it has grown
However, isn't it preferred to have autism over dying at a young age from an easily preventable disease
it depends on which disease, just compare the US vaccine schedule to other nations' vaccine schedules
in general, they shouldn't be mandatory either, as that further escalates the whole situation
as the cumulative aluminum exposure has increased, it can be correlated with autism on multiple ways, not just through injection. Also through the brain studies
1 mcg/g dry wt. aluminum is pathologically benign
autism is still not nearly as bad as the multitudes of old world diseases one could contract, and, even if true, is still in extremely minute and rare cases. if nothing else, this is a matter of simply "which is worse" or even "which is riskier" to an extent
but having this diagnosis for live sounds defeatist from a philosophical standpoint
infection diseases are treatable. To some extend, vaccines that don't contain aluminum exist
if further research should be done on this, then more brain tissues of people diagnosed with ASD who died should be measured (either GF-AAS, ICP-AES or ICP-MS)
otherwise it's a matter of taking some biopts from the brain tissue, which is going to cost more money (surgeon costs)
one of the investigated inviduals had high levels of aluminum in her drinking water (chronic exposure)
furthermore, saying that kids are going to die if they don't take certain vaccines is a flawed argument to state that it's OK for children to suffer vaccine (induced) injury to prevent diseases they could've been exposed to
thimerosal is known to decrease methionine production through inhibiting the enzyme MS
For those who think it's safe to drink it, here you can buy it:
one of the causes is disordered methylation
how is it a flawed argument when these cases of dangerous vaccines are less than a fraction of a percent
this is the exact result of blowing up a problem that barely exists
there's so many other harmful side effects to other daily facets of life like food chemicals that are FDA sanctioned yet you choose to waste your time because autism is the worst thing that can ever happen to a person
Sure it doesn't mean someone's going to flat out die without a vaccine
But its an unneeded risk that we as a fairly technologically advanced society do not wish to take for the betterment of society
Not only do unvaccinated kids pose risk on themselves but on others
even the deaths are a fraction of that percent
and even when combined with complications today
this is like specifically choosing not to seek out professional help when you break a limb, get a blood clot, need surgery, etc., and perform progressive matters yourselves because of your unnatural fear of modern medicine
Furthermore, vaccines are highly lucrative, here are some websites about the vaccine market:
i'm sure they are
it's a billion dollar industry
what's your point
do you know where those billions go to?
and my point it, that we should first stop using excess vaccines, furthermore replacing the aluminum salts with safer adjuvants (AHCC) and make the production organic.
One step between these three steps and today is to create a third party quality mark
wait, this brings a new idea: should there be a quality mark for vaccines?
where do those billions of dollars go to
you seem to know
so share the answer instead of just asking us
I just give you the time to think or research
and since google is censoring information critical towards vaccination, use duckduckgo instead
interestingly, there are studies debunking the effectiveness of the flu shot:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3209321/ (lower levels of antibodies on average in vaccinated children (flu))
one way to test the effectiveness of a vaccine for individuals, is through blood titer tests
and lastly, for those who think vaccines are safe, do your own research logically using ddg as a search engine, then think again
vaccines make live
i'm sure vaccines can be improved exponentially especially as we just naturally improve over time with our scientific discoveries and findings. my only argument was that it is very ignorant and illogical to be against vaccines as a whole as opposed to the alternative of "natural" remedies and vitamins and whatever which are not potent enough for the more serious "eradicated" diseases that have been reportedly popping up again.
would you rather? eliminate the disease or eliminate it's deaths and complications?
definitely the death and complications, but unfortunately we don't live in a perfect world and we have to make do with what we have. there's a difference between pushing forward ideas for improved vaccines and safer/alternative methods of administering them (for instance i remember some sort of puff of air type of vaccination) vs spreading fear-mongering propaganda which is potentially much more harmful to the kids and their peers around them who would end up unvaccinated
either getting no necessary vaccines or getting excess vaccines is a bad idea. Thoughts on chicken pox and swine flu?
in Europe, there won't be any vaccines used for chicken pox and swine flu
ask yourself, for which diseases has the US vaccines in schedule that European nations haven't for?
further more, i saw something about a rhinovirus vaccine being on its way. for those who don't know that's the common cold. imo there is no worse idea than that; do we want to go back to being Neanderthals dying of a common cold since it's been vaccinated against so we've evolved away from being able to cope with it? i'd say no. so in short: excessive vaccination against diseases that we have no hope of eradicating is a bad idea but if we can eradicate it i think we should
which two factors significantly decreased deaths and harsh complications before the introduction of vaccines?
antibiotics for bacteria infection and better care but if you can eradicate a disease entirely surely that's a better option as bacteria do develop resistances to antibiotics (ik there is some research into phage organisms iirc which has found that they can kill the bacteria and for the bacteria to become resistant to them they have to sacrifice resistance to antibiotics which is rather interesting)
What i want is evidence that vaccines dont help
you can do your own research without using biased search engines like google. As there is an algorithm that cherry-picks studies
vaccines do help and work but there are problems with them especially when they're used too much
the necessary vaccines help, these are of course for diseases like whooping cough, dipheteria, tetanus, meningococcus and pertussis
some are excessive, like the flu vaccine
the flu vaccine is excessive just so the flu is usually not as bad as if you didnt take it
yeah the flu vaccine is more of a 50/50 right? and it's better to build up the immunity and even if it is a "strain" as such that can kill you it can be treated anyway right?
I expected a higher probability
The influenza virus has multiple strains
scientist guess one of those strains each year to vaccinate
so it wouldn't really be the exact strand that defininitive year
So its more like 1/1000 for it to work, numbers are off though as this is only a quick explamation
the reason why im ugly is vaccines
@Jim Halpert#9969 omg is that really u??? i love the office!!1!!!1!!!
Why are people against vaccines
It's actually killing people as well....
Can we get this straight? Vaccines are helping and if ppl would just get vaccinated polio would be eradicated by now
mатериал#5927 (249269776730292235) is now muted for '**Unspecified.**', alright? <:THUMBSUP6:403560443345371137>
Polio rates had already declined before the vaccine was introduced it says
Do u believe vaccines cause autism
Because autism is genetic and nothing after birth could possibly give u a genetic condition
Can you show me that data?
That drop was durinf its testing they have said
That cod be hygene also increased
That also shows it dropped after the vaccine so
Also I'm talking about the graphs
biological hygiene is going well, but chemical hygiene is going bad
with chemical hygiene, it's about emission and exposure regarding toxins
and especially mitigating both
With accompanying data plz.
vaccine for polio is necessary
but for flu is unnecessary
since each year a new flu vaccine is made, we should also look into resaerch of each recent flu shot
@Citizen Z have you read this insert of the Yellow Fever vaccine?
I wonder, why does it say that if you think you've overdosed on the YF vaccine that you have to see a doctor or go to the poison control center?
i dont know enough to have a real opinion on this and i didnt read through everything here, but i like what you just said abt the vaccine for polio vs the flu @Lancelot
the opinion about the MMR vaccine remains still mixed. At one hand you can survive all three diseases without complications or death, but once you are unlucky to get one, it's horrible to experience something like that
moving it to 12 years age would be reasonable as mumps is more severe after puberty
since chances of complications are higher among post-puberty men
to determine whether MMR is needed to not, it should be individualized. Blood titers is one method
I cant post
It wont allow me. It didnt just disappear by magic
in between, since some are necessary while others aren't necessary
especially if I compare the US vaccine schedule with the Dutch, Japanese and Islandic vaccine schedules
what makes them unnecessary
The flu isn't as necessary since it's not insanly deadly
population / cases (how much % of population got disease);
severity of disease;
cases of disease divided by death rates + complications of disease ;
safer alternatives if possible;
cases of vaccine side effects & death of the disease vs cases of disease complications & death
in the US, the real issue is overvaccination
this is how aluminum (both Al(OH3) and AlPO4) travel to the brain
and this is how these adjuvants look like under an electron microscope
and here inside MFs
Note that the aluminum here is found 1 year later in the brain after intramuscular injection
Can anyone kinda give input from both sides? Since i don’t know much about this to have a solid opinion, i want to know both sides
I can give a multisided opinion
first of, understand that both sides have zealots
one that refuses vaccines. An authoritarian anti-vaccine policy is banning vaccines
the other side of zealots believes vaccines should be mandatory, which is their coercive idea
in the middle however, we should still allow vaccines, but should get a quality mark at least, sometimes a ban if necessary
you have necessary vaccines and excess vaccines, the pro-vaccine zealots push for both vaccines
examples of excess vaccines:
Mexican flu (treatable with IVC);
HPV (more side effects than cervical cancer cases);
Vitamin K (actually still a shot, but not vaccine)```
Ebola (vaccine wasn't required if ebola wasn't manufactured)```
on substances, here are questionalbe ingredients:
```aluminum salts (aluminum hydroxide and aluminum phosphate, both don't dissolve in water and get captured by MFs after intramuscular injection (transport to brain, could take a year));
organic mercury (thimerosal, although some say it's a safe amount, it's unrecommended for pregnant mothers, could lower IQ when used on children);
polysorbate 80 (carcinogen and could cause sterility in females, some are allergic);
chicken protein (some are allergic)```
```Aborted fetal tissue (human): (See picture)```
look for studies on sciencedirect and researchgate, search bar suggestions:
```Polysorbate 80 toxicity```
One question: do you all legitmatly think vaccines are killing more people then what the viruses they prevent do
if your an anti vaxxer i think you would have to think vaccines kill more people
unless im wrong
im not lul
Do your own research..question things. There is no problem with that. Stop spreading gossip and saying things people didnt say. All vaccines are different and should be questioned as such
people do say that
plus if you think vaccines are harmfull wouldnt u say the viruses kill less? i mean id hope thats what you think if your an anti vaxer
and i have done research
research from which websites?
cite your sources
just like I've done
Anti-Vax people are legitimate retards.
on jah#9840 (514761193496510465) is now muted for '**Unspecified.**', alright? <:THUMBSUP6:403560443345371137>
i got vaccinated and now i cant get meningitis
but i have autism
have you any idea what went into your body except the weakened pathogen?
no, but i dont really need to
so you believe all vaccines are safe
if I would spike one vaccine with cyanide and you take it, would you still believe all vaccines are safe?
why do people hate vaccines
Because we actually get off our asses and do some actual work into researching their ingredients, effects, dates of inception, what the times looked like before vaccinations and what has transpired until now. Critical thinking stuff.
Try it and you may understand why people have an issue with them.
If vaccines are bad, then why is it that when a country is developed enough to get regular vaccines throughout the population, the death rate decreases
And dont give me the autism argument. I would rather be autistic than dead
If vaccines were as bad as some people say they are, 90% of us would be dead as of now. (Tag me to reply so I dont forget)
if vaccines are bad then why are people who are unvaccinated have measles
Why wouldn't you vaccinate your child?
Alright, <@!364087995508326402> has been warned for '**Bad word usage**'.
I bet your husband left you
Who gave you the n word pass
Shut the fu ck up no you're not
Yknow there's nothing to say to that
I wish they removed the 13th amendment
Alright, <@!364087995508326402> has been warned for '**Bad word usage**'.
Ha agent smith is cu cking you good
Hey guys *blink blink* mind if I join *UWU*
Why did you say *blink blink*
Are you missing a *chromosome*?
What do you expect to happen if you get measles?
we will see
one day, there will be a fall of those who rule. They will either learn by the soft way through admitting the truth, or the hard way through various lawsuits and punishment
I have some non anti vaxxer points against vaccines
Meaning I believe vaccines appear to be mostly safe unless you’re like allergic to metal or something
And if they know that you are allergic to said substance they will inject you with a substitute for that substance that does the exact same thing.
I don’t know anything about that
But I think the way people pitch the flu vaccine as a civic duty is pedantic and unfounded.
Vaccines are proven to prevent the flu. But are they the *best* way? Studies suggest just a vitamin D supplement from walmart might be more effective
And while flue vaccines are usually offered free at pharmacies, vaccines in general can be expensive. When Europeans assume anyone who does not vaccinate is just a brainlet, they are showing their ignorance of healthcare and insurance costs in the US
As for herd immunity, some people like myself simply do not care if we give others the flu. If you are immunodeficient or have HIV then you have bigger problems than anti vaxxers
A medical question has been turned into a political dialectic where anyone who chooses not to vaccinate is assumed to believe vaccines are very harmful.
People who think mainstream science is under attack by Russian fake news are just as bad as evangelicals
My brain hurts now.
iT'S ThE VaCcInEs
Ok but what is your opinion on my position
Since you’re talking to me idk
Did you say “ta*d”
I mean your stance on flu vaccines kinda pisses me off but like as long as you're not giving me ƃuᴉʞɔnɟ measles idfc.
Do you get the flu vaccine every year
Nope. I usually get one that lasts like ƃuᴉʞɔnɟ 5 years.
So i go to get one every 5 years.
It's expensive asf but like i ain't tryna get poked.
I've never had the flu in my life.
Personally I haven’t had the flu since I was in highschool, and then I used it as an excuse to stay out of school. So there was never any need to get the flu shot
Yeah but that's the thing.
Just because you don't get the flu doesn't mean you don't carry it.
I am building my immune system
People should stop being hypochondriacs
Nobody likes the flu though.
Like they're not being hypochondriacs.