Well I'm open to seeing what you have to share DeeJay. I can can entertain ideas

https://youtu.be/3YszdBk4fGY

My surname comes from an island in denmark, via some french village where the spelling changed

but I'm pretty sure most of my history is in the cape

I don't want to look for it later lol since this is YouTube videos mostly, create a Playlist, and share the Playlist, will bring your spam count down, but also offer a lot of follow up vids with one link.

Let's rock and roll, I'm bored. Spirituality... what is it?

My battery is almost flat and you want to start now lol

haha

hahaha shit ok we can do it later

I'll start, bhagavad gita says that life is a series of moments between a subject and and object

Let's maybe just get our methods of reasoning straight? Make sure we on the same page in what we accept

think of it like a film strip and each frame has a subject and an object

@Sheamus Let's not get too formal. Lets just chat and see

when we started the scientific method we started measuring the object, and various people recorded their interations with objects, the common factors were noted and we had the scientific method of identifying objective reality

@rob In your own personal opinion?

the scientists continued drilling down to find the ultimate objects that made up the world

all my take on what I understand from the various sources I mention

The deepest hole ever drilled is the Kola Ultradeep borehole in Russia somewhere. 12 Kilometers.

Why not make this formal? What we've been doing so far is pretty casual, but this is already a topic we formally agreed on doing, which is already formal as i see it.

Ditsem! @Sheamus, you just advanced to level 6!

in the early 20th century quantum physicists realised that they can't measure an object without affecting it by virtue of the measurement

coming back to the point that life is not objects but a series of subject object connections

@Sheamus Suggestions?

and science is the study of the object

spirituality/religion is the study of the subject

anyway, just wanted to flesh out what I think the subject/self/soul is in relation to science and religion

Ditsem! @rob, you just advanced to level 5!

Yeah, let's start with a common principle that we all can agree on? I like the golden rule, And use that principle as reference to our agreement on what we can best relate to as fair and equal.

I like the golden rule, I find it easier to explain by describing its opposite

Rob you nailed it again

humans have the capacity for evil because they know what would feel terrible for themselves to experience and they can therefore do that to others. the golden rule is the opposite of torture/pure evil

Materialsim is the opposite of Spirituality.

And from there, you can logically deduce the nature of man.

Yes, agreed with you guys.. But creation is the balance of the two. Balance is key. Always have to balance everything to solve problems lol

I'm doing some MS PAINT work brb

Lol why ms paint, if you going to be cheap, then at least get gimp

quantum experiments have also confirmed that there is a group non material reality(holy spirit if you like) that generates our material reality in the same way that our immatterial thoughts generate our material electrical impulses in our brain https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/coming-to-grips-with-the-implications-of-quantum-mechanics/

thanks guys 😃 I enjoy chatting about this stuff

@Sheamus looool

You are always welcome here bud, i like both of your company so far, both of you are very engaging intellectuals. It's a relief from the emotional drama found in other parts of the net.

To be more precise, materialism and spirituality exist as opposite ends of the same scale. And in order to define spirituality, we must first define materialism.

ja I think smaller groups are important, it's eternal september out there

good question, what is materialism?

We are born into the material world right?

I don't understand it, I always think that after I die I'll get to go through a library of life videos and watch my life and I always think, that's why it's not supposed to be easy, and why it would be horrible to be a prince for example(you'd have to do so much more to have a video worth watching)

you want a story with challenge overcome

Anything you can quantify , or see, or touch. Even your children. EVERYTHING that exists outside of the conscious mind is a materialist attachment.

Well if you define the one, the other is defined naturally. So we can discuss either materialism or spirituality

although, now writing that I'm thinking what if it's a library of video games, and what if we're already there playing one now 💥

We love rugby? How can you love rugby if you can also love a woman? Therefore materialism is also everything we do.

Lol after chowing down on 🍄 i have likened it to a VR like experience honestly

so does that mean that other entities are all NPCs?

or does the materialist believe themselves to be some sort of determanistic machine

or am I just confused

Yes, well those that are emotional are, they are subject to nature's will, biology at work, part of the system, where is intellectuals, are the players with avatars to have an experience

😆

so the materialist believes that only they and a few others potentially are conscious

I've wondered that once or twice.....

Ever noticed how predictable the emotional heathens are? Like badly programmed AI

it's crazy

The problem today is @rob , everyone believes themselves to be somewhat spiritual, but no one can even define the word.

friends that I know are intelligent are brainwashed

Flat earth makes sense in a matrix lol, majority of games use that model of you've opened a map from an editor.

they are often materialistic in their spirituality, it is something outside to display for status(much like our SJWs)

I suppose that's why jesus was all about praying in secret

So... physical things from the material world can not exist in the spiritual world right? Because it's the opposite end of the scale. Therefore, the names and concept of things of the material can not logically exist there.

And intelligence is not the same as intellect.

I sound like such a bible basher 😆

That's why it is said that God loves everyone equally. Because God literally can not differentiate between people and things. By definition.

Not at all really to be honest, you aren't substituting a reason with an offence.

I think the vedic view is that there isn't a separation between sprit and thing, the spirit generates the thing from what I understand. but scientists have tried to pinpoint the thing, only to find smaller things ad infintum (eventually they will realise that they are willing smaller and smaller particles into existence)

nice

there is no thing until a consciousness gives it its thingness - a rock is not a rock until a conscience separates it from being 'ground' or 'mountain' or 'planet earth' or the entirety of reality

Yes, so we can agree then on the golden rule? Love thy neighbour as thy own self, or This is the sum of duty; do naught onto others what you would not have them do unto you.

beatrice.com/TAO.txt

The Tao Te Ching a modern interpretation of Lao Tzu perpetrated by Ron Hogan

lol

nice

That's the first non-fiction book I've read in 20 years. 2 Months ago I think.

@Sheamus I think the golden rule is true if you think about it for any amount of time, but what if there are other people with a different spiritual makeup that appear human ?

I've started doing audiobooks, highly recommended, less effort than reading and you can speed up speech to around the same speed as reading

Yes, i just need to confirm if we agree to it, so we can agree to measure one another argument by it. 🙂

also in light of 'journalism' nowadays and the propoganda in movies, books are still good

Yeah started listening to audio books too, actually wasn't to start finding some good quality sources.

Personally I'd rather get the right answer than pick a winner.

But lets do it.

Agreed, I'm so happy to know I'm not the only one to notice the propaganda.. It's shameless how open they are about it even.

Wait, what about a winner now? Everyone must be a winner if we agree on the golden rule, that's the point for me to suggest using that as a measure.

my friends annoy me the most, with their reasoning "but rob, you _can't_ say _that_"

You can't say that lol... Yet you said it and proved them wrong.. The ignorance lol

giving the other debater benefit of the boubt in a debate instead of picking at semantics is an example of why the golden rule just makes things smoother

Yes, but this isn't a debate, it's us reasoning together

Ok, you guys sound like seasoned debaters, so one of you please go first?

Doing the whole logos thing, the relationship of brotherhood

just noticing where the golden rule helps society. ebay by all acounts should have lasted a week, people pay, people run away with the money, but it didn't people trusted each other.

quite a few times I run into the idea that morality doesn't need a religious basis, or it does - what are your thoughts on that one?

Yeah agreed, golden rule is the only rule you need. Confucias had it nicely set for societal approach. Do not do to others what you would not like yourself. Then there will be no resentment against you, either in the family or in the state.

DeeJay you agree to the golden rule as the ideal way to define what's reasonable?

where does that put us with psychopaths?

and bipolar women (ducks)

Ah that's a discussion on solutions... We should maybe try get a room going for that where we can reason on solutions to our problems