fake-news

Discord ID: 399204742846349312


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2018-10-12 18:21:58 UTC

@Blackhawk342 perfect ๐Ÿ˜‚

2018-10-12 18:48:05 UTC

"Melania Trump said something stupid, now let us prove that it is not stupid"

2018-10-12 19:17:03 UTC

"Top 10 reasons why Melania trump is a fucking idiot and not being bullied"

-Daily Beast

2018-10-12 19:17:38 UTC

Recommended: Gallery of Outfits That Show Melania Is Racist

2018-10-12 19:19:39 UTC

Number 8 will shock you!!!!!

2018-10-12 19:21:37 UTC

Lol

2018-10-12 21:42:46 UTC

โ€œ Why the Kanye West-Jim Brown lunch with Trump was a disaster โ€œ by Nia - Malika Henderson on CNN

This article suggest that Kanye West , Jim Brown , and Trump are somehow putting lives in danger by having a lunch meeting. CNN is deranged.

http://archive.today/p9vcz

2018-10-12 21:57:05 UTC

```"Imagine if Germany had a slogan called "Make Germany Great Again"```
You would instantaneously be called a Nazi and be under surveilance of the Verfassungsschutz.

2018-10-12 21:57:14 UTC

maybe even thrown in Jail

2018-10-12 21:58:40 UTC

You would instantaneously be called a Nazi, thrown in Jail, and all your associates would be under surveilance of the Verfassungsschutz.
Fixed it for you @Stefan Payne

2018-10-12 21:59:24 UTC

yeah, you see what the CDUSPD wants to do with the AfD and they aren't even that right wing.

2018-10-12 22:00:07 UTC

they are just a bunch of people that took out the Programm of the CDUSPD and FDP from like 30 years ago, threw it in a blender and made it their own.

2018-10-12 22:19:41 UTC

Donโ€™t they call you a Nazi for waving the flag in Germany? Seems like the bar is low there.

2018-10-12 22:47:07 UTC

Hmm

2018-10-12 22:47:10 UTC

what happened to trump?

2018-10-12 22:47:14 UTC

got called a Nazi.

2018-10-13 00:45:55 UTC

```Donโ€™t they call you a Nazi for waving the flag in Germany? Seems like the bar is low there.```
Yeah, but it seems that there are only a small bunch that really cares, many people aren't really political. They just don't know.
So it might be effective to go to marketplaces and shout there to deliver your message

2018-10-13 00:46:08 UTC

tell them that the greens want to kill all men for example.

2018-10-13 00:50:12 UTC

`Imagine if Germany had a slogan called "Make Germany Great Again`
if only germany was that woke.
time to wake up again germany and this time do real holocaust.

2018-10-13 00:52:07 UTC

Only a matter of time to be honest...

2018-10-13 00:52:26 UTC

But there is hope that the CDU gets rid of Merkel

2018-10-14 01:49:24 UTC

crazy old cat ladies gathering is news now..

2018-10-14 02:21:24 UTC

Just came post some high-tier dishonesty from the media

2018-10-14 02:23:43 UTC

It seems to be a matter of basic fact, yeah.

2018-10-14 02:23:55 UTC

I mean, it is an interesting thing to talk about.

2018-10-14 02:24:19 UTC

Not sure how necessary it really is to show any appreciation for even the most respected confederates.

2018-10-14 04:04:11 UTC

dang

2018-10-14 04:04:16 UTC

that's *spicy*

2018-10-14 17:58:36 UTC

https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1051523821642113025

**CORRECTION**: All the shit we just said was wrong.

2018-10-14 18:00:18 UTC

"War will come"

2018-10-14 18:02:14 UTC

All the shit they just said was intentionally wrong.

2018-10-14 22:20:35 UTC

You mean with saudi Arabia??

2018-10-15 02:54:50 UTC

FAKE.

2018-10-15 02:54:58 UTC

NEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEWWWS

2018-10-15 16:24:32 UTC

Haha

2018-10-15 19:42:01 UTC

What was the name of that news website that rates 4 news articles a day? Tim and Luke meet them at Anarcapoko last year.

2018-10-15 20:00:49 UTC

!rank

2018-10-15 20:00:50 UTC

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/399204742846349312/501484618307076137/card.png

2018-10-15 21:25:03 UTC

There's nothing really false in these articles and they acknowledge how weak the results are. But if you do a survey of headlines today you'll find they're all very misleading.

Once you get to 1-2% of these DNA tests you're frequently talking about noise and random factors in the analysis.

This is literally <1%. Something like 0.5 to 0.09% native american. According to a set of partitions that are defined by looking at a group of people and just drawing an arbitrary line.

2018-10-15 21:33:42 UTC

what did she originally claim? that she was native, or that she had a native ancestor?

2018-10-15 21:34:32 UTC

these articles make it sound like she described her family history as having a native american somewhere far back
which is unremarkable but also not false?

2018-10-15 21:45:01 UTC

I believe it had something to do with way overstating her native ancestry

2018-10-15 21:45:08 UTC

but thats been a while ago

2018-10-15 21:45:10 UTC

The latter from what I can tell. The implication would be used to "prove" the former.

You're talking about 6th or 10th generation. That's like 150 or 250 years ago. It could very well be noise as she hasn't released the raw results. Only the analysis performed by someone at Stanford.

Given the ages involved, you could almost disprove her argument if you could trace her family history that far back (but there's so many people at that point it would be hard to exhaustively show none had arrived before then--remember that the *United States* is only 242 years old).

2018-10-15 21:45:40 UTC

The controversy is that she claimed native american ancestry to get a tenure-track job at Harvard as a diversity hire back in the 90s.

2018-10-15 21:46:17 UTC

And then they actually traced it back and couldn't find any immediate native american ancestors and she couldn't actually claim membership of any tribes (which is distinct from genetics, actually).

2018-10-15 21:46:35 UTC

It's more like, lying outright to get a job.

2018-10-15 21:47:57 UTC

Amusingly, I think this is a great case of the right not actually caring except to rub it in her face.

The inter-sectional left views it as a cardinal sin and it's been haunting her over the primaries in MA.

2018-10-15 21:54:19 UTC

apparently she was hired as a white woman

2018-10-15 21:54:33 UTC

but changed her listed ethnicity after 3 years

2018-10-15 21:54:36 UTC

<:WaitWhat:433646897383866369>

2018-10-15 21:54:46 UTC

This will be used against them. Now people with 1% african heritage can start saying slurs and no one can do anything about it.

2018-10-15 21:54:54 UTC

lol

2018-10-15 21:55:26 UTC

Cultural appropriation is ok so long as you have at least 1% of whatever you are appropriating.

2018-10-15 21:55:31 UTC

@shinsoo She claimed she was Native American to get a job.

2018-10-15 21:55:36 UTC

or to help her get a job.

2018-10-15 21:56:11 UTC

I mean the argument is absurd

2018-10-15 21:56:21 UTC

but..like she is full of shit on it.

2018-10-15 21:56:52 UTC

calling her Native American is ridiculous, aye

2018-10-15 21:57:56 UTC

Yeah, we can argue if it even matters.

2018-10-15 21:58:14 UTC

But by any means, her claim is specious and it's hard to call her native american.

2018-10-15 22:01:09 UTC

Also, it could be that it was the university that wanted her to be listed as Native American. There are lots of programs that open up when you can make that claim (just as there are special grants for women and minority owned businesses).

2018-10-15 22:01:34 UTC

She clearly went along with it at the very least.

2018-10-15 22:02:45 UTC

As an aside, I think a lot of this shows how dumb IDPol and race is in things like affirmative action.

Clearly, if you draw the line a little (ok, way far out) to one side you can claim all sorts of things.

2018-10-15 22:02:46 UTC

that would a shady in a whole different way

2018-10-15 22:03:00 UTC

The whole thing is shady.

2018-10-15 22:03:06 UTC

Which is why it keeps floating around.

2018-10-15 23:18:08 UTC

----

Just saw Tim's video on Warren. Can confirm the math is wrong. It should be between 2^-6=1/64 and 2^-10=1/1012 Native American. Also should have 4 "greats" in "great-great-great-great grandmother" to be 6th generation. Why can't the Boston Globe do math?

2018-10-15 23:26:56 UTC

math is hard

2018-10-15 23:36:33 UTC

@pratel who has access to a calculator these days?

2018-10-15 23:41:39 UTC

Just use an online one

2018-10-15 23:50:01 UTC

WAT

2018-10-16 00:44:37 UTC

Calculators and math are colonialism

2018-10-16 00:44:43 UTC

Just slap a number in there

2018-10-16 00:45:17 UTC

Elizabeth Warren confirmed cultural appropriator tho

2018-10-16 03:52:59 UTC

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/399204742846349312/501603437662830623/1539661855032.png

2018-10-16 12:29:50 UTC

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qJq-m0XZ9U

"I didn't realize it was offensive to claim you are native american"

.... the left doesn't know that its racist to claim to be native american while clearly being white

2018-10-16 12:30:09 UTC

seriously, this seems like the bs from the goddamn 60s

2018-10-16 12:30:23 UTC

"i can't be racist, i'm 1/200th black"

2018-10-16 12:33:45 UTC

"All of us are descended from Mitochondrial Eve so all of us can say the n word"

2018-10-16 12:52:15 UTC

It the 1 Drop Blood rule that was too racist/extreme for the Nazis

2018-10-16 12:54:31 UTC

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/399204742846349312/501739723228839956/nuremburgracelaws.gif

2018-10-16 13:01:57 UTC

That chart seems to have errors

2018-10-16 13:14:46 UTC

there was one mistake

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/399204742846349312/501744816481370123/nuremburgracelaws.gif

2018-10-16 13:26:42 UTC

Hmm I was sure there was an existing document of the thing with a similar formt.

2018-10-16 13:27:52 UTC

Still with warren's "heritage" i could stand next to a cherokee who was just shot in the head splattering me with cherokee blood and it would make me more cherokee than warren

2018-10-16 13:51:34 UTC

really?

2018-10-16 13:51:38 UTC

its a painting you child

2018-10-16 13:52:06 UTC

'member when Kimmel was funny? not many people are that old

2018-10-16 14:06:24 UTC

i do

2018-10-16 14:06:28 UTC

I remember the man show

2018-10-16 14:06:32 UTC

i remember watching that show

2018-10-16 14:06:38 UTC

I member girls on trampolines

2018-10-16 14:07:05 UTC

I remember the good days....they didn't last long

2018-10-16 14:07:20 UTC

why jimmy

2018-10-16 14:07:22 UTC

I unironically like that painting and I can't quite put my finger on why

2018-10-16 14:07:58 UTC

you were supposed to destroy PC culture not become it!

2018-10-16 14:58:27 UTC

anybody remember when late night shows would make fun of all the idiocy

2018-10-16 14:58:32 UTC

instead of just defaulting to one side

2018-10-16 15:01:06 UTC

Yes. Those days have been gone since the bush presidency tho

2018-10-16 15:12:15 UTC

I mean, pretty much everyone loves YouTube

2018-10-16 15:15:45 UTC

Still waiting for the Vox article about the Daily Stormer supporting the NYT <:TimThink:482277772497125378>

2018-10-16 15:15:45 UTC

Nobody said shit about Obama's painting lol.

2018-10-16 15:16:09 UTC

@oprahsminge meh, i'd say since around 2012, start of obamas second term

2018-10-16 15:16:26 UTC

<#463059337162653716>

2018-10-16 15:22:43 UTC

This just in mouths are a popular tool among alt-right peoples when recruiting

2018-10-16 16:39:13 UTC

"Recruiting?" Lol, I got my card in the mail yesterday and my handbook for which words I must speak to be a member.

2018-10-16 17:05:39 UTC

The article uses alt-right as a slur, with no definition of what it actually means. Says alt-right are racists whithout explaining why they are allegedly racists. Guys if you want to write an article against it, you have learn more about the alt-right movement.

2018-10-16 17:08:21 UTC

its NPC news, all you need to do is repeat buzz words.

2018-10-16 17:11:33 UTC

Yup. Article is written not for persuasion, but to reenforce those values.

2018-10-16 17:13:25 UTC

Still I think Tim had a point when he said these articles are written mainly for clicks, its mostly clickbait, and it also brings in useful idiots who want their ideas validated.

2018-10-16 17:19:13 UTC

I agree, that is their prime motivation in writing them.

2018-10-16 17:32:11 UTC

And I think Ill trust his word on that

2018-10-16 17:32:18 UTC

Afterall hes been in the industry long enough

2018-10-16 21:17:24 UTC

I think these articles are being written mainly to incite harassment and deplatforming.

2018-10-16 22:19:24 UTC

yurp

2018-10-16 22:59:25 UTC

@Senny The alt-right loves _dogs_!

2018-10-16 23:00:04 UTC

go execute your dogs, fellow non-degenerates.

2018-10-16 23:05:09 UTC

well that means I am not alt right then

2018-10-16 23:18:22 UTC

good thing I'm more of a cat person

2018-10-16 23:18:29 UTC

checkmate bigots

2018-10-17 00:10:04 UTC

does alt right pick leader based on who is best

2018-10-17 00:10:15 UTC

is the purer, the better?

2018-10-17 00:10:29 UTC

NEWS ALERT

2018-10-17 00:10:40 UTC

Warren is the new Head of the Alt-Right

2018-10-17 00:31:30 UTC

Elizabeth "Even the Alt Right Ain't This White" Warren @Oktin

2018-10-17 01:11:01 UTC

Its so true

2018-10-17 06:02:31 UTC

Lmao

2018-10-17 06:02:41 UTC

Do they know it's just a game lol

2018-10-17 06:02:58 UTC

A fictional game with a fictional storyline with over the top characters

2018-10-17 06:03:10 UTC

And fake technology

2018-10-17 06:03:24 UTC

Like they really think people are dumb, good lord

2018-10-17 06:07:53 UTC

Nuclear weapons are supposedly real, but I get that you are referring to personal sized nuke launchers.

2018-10-17 07:20:57 UTC

tfw too cool to play blackops 4 <:poppocool:483444791447781399>

2018-10-17 10:21:16 UTC

journos, asking the REALLY important questions

2018-10-17 11:36:43 UTC

Once again, attacking gamers

2018-10-17 11:55:17 UTC

RIGHT WING

2018-10-17 11:59:11 UTC

oh wow nyt reporting on the latest memes

2018-10-17 11:59:20 UTC

paper of record

2018-10-17 12:00:08 UTC

http://archive.is/y6Gz0 โฌ… Don't click NYT links. let them starve.

2018-10-17 12:04:49 UTC

inb4 they shut down 4chan for election interference.

2018-10-17 12:04:49 UTC

@Atkins I guess, you have small screen size, scroll up ๐Ÿ˜‰

2018-10-17 12:05:36 UTC

i posted the archive link because i don't want people giving the NYT clicks.

2018-10-17 12:05:41 UTC

ah ok

2018-10-17 14:21:49 UTC

Use archive links and an adblocker.

2018-10-17 14:27:25 UTC

Especially for your European Brothers

2018-10-17 14:27:50 UTC

there was this Privacy thing that some people in the US don't want to apply to so they blocked Euro

2018-10-17 14:28:09 UTC

GDPR

2018-10-17 15:03:59 UTC

Okay..how come no journalist can get the story right despite everyone else knowing how this meme got big ?
Haven't seen a single one mentioning that Kotaku is the one who blow this meme into popularity because they self identified with it..
HMMMMM ๐Ÿค”
http://archive.is/lstdF

2018-10-17 22:00:40 UTC

the Gamers are RISING UP

2018-10-18 01:10:56 UTC

<:FeelsGoodMan:498368845661077505>

2018-10-18 04:27:03 UTC

Yeah, push them too hard and they will rise.

2018-10-18 04:27:55 UTC

and the worst thing: They ain't no politica, they want to play the shit they like and be left alone - but the left does not leave them alone. And now they have to fight back against the Regressive Commies....

2018-10-18 05:01:27 UTC

oh deer

2018-10-18 05:13:20 UTC

Gamers thicc

2018-10-18 08:52:34 UTC

SEX

2018-10-18 09:18:34 UTC

tbh, I hate to call them NPCs, because it doesn't account for their tendency to go after weak, isolated targets, whenever they realize that they have an advantage

2018-10-18 09:20:08 UTC

I guess that's when the MOB ai takes over

2018-10-19 02:28:05 UTC

<:NPC:500042527231967262>

2018-10-19 07:42:15 UTC

Isn't it slander??

2018-10-19 07:42:26 UTC

Can't Superยต sue Bloomberg for Defamation??

2018-10-20 01:04:06 UTC

I've been out of the loop for a little while. Have people discussed the Russian feminist story Tim reported on, and how the Daily Wire condemned it as Russian propaganda? (https://www.dailywire.com/news/37106/fake-news-video-woman-pouring-bleach-manspreaders-joseph-curl)
Apologies if I'm way late on this one. You all chat far too much for me to keep track.

2018-10-20 01:25:09 UTC

It was a parody I recall.

2018-10-20 01:25:21 UTC

She was an actress, it was all staged

2018-10-20 01:27:29 UTC

Yup. I just remember Tim reporting on it as fact, and was wondering if the (honest) mistake had been brought up.

2018-10-20 01:31:19 UTC

I don't know. I thought it was true when it came out (because I can no longer distinguish the Left from satire), and was just curious as to whether others had been caught up in it too.

2018-10-20 04:45:35 UTC

AHAHAHAHAHHA]

2018-10-20 04:45:46 UTC

GET FUCKED SUPER DELUXE

2018-10-20 05:09:44 UTC

Also its russia, if it were true, shed probably get decked

2018-10-20 05:42:06 UTC

Super deluxe had cheap thrills which was sick

2018-10-20 05:42:13 UTC

Everything else is balls

2018-10-20 07:44:08 UTC

oh no, we have a bunch of witch-hunting dickbags who are all out of work, that gives me a special feeling in the cockels of my heart

2018-10-20 07:46:32 UTC

oh Mike deleted it?

2018-10-20 07:49:51 UTC
2018-10-20 07:50:01 UTC

>"the meme ecosystem"
XD

2018-10-20 07:52:39 UTC

where they get their "content"

2018-10-20 09:12:51 UTC

never knew anything about super delux besides this tbh https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jdwhKRZuBw

2018-10-20 09:13:48 UTC

what did the shitposting median develop into?

2018-10-20 10:09:27 UTC

It's tricky getting details, but there may have been some stalking/harassment of Cernovich's family, apparently they reported it to the police

2018-10-20 10:10:05 UTC

I mean I haven't seen a thing but I can't see Cernovich lying about that

2018-10-22 03:36:52 UTC

Hi everyone ๐Ÿ˜€

2018-10-22 03:37:21 UTC

Howdy

2018-10-22 03:38:55 UTC

```Itโ€™s not uncommon for white supremacist, fascist and anti-Semitic beliefs to arise initially as the result of humor. Four of the seventy-five activists we studied mentioned ironic memes as major red-pills.```

2018-10-22 03:39:09 UTC

๐Ÿคฆ

2018-10-22 03:41:03 UTC

Oh god

2018-10-22 03:41:20 UTC

Apparently 4/75 is "not uncommon"

2018-10-22 03:41:32 UTC

So we are going to outlaw humor now

2018-10-22 03:43:24 UTC

To use game terms: this writer would be perfectly comfortable with a random drop of 5% being "Common"

2018-10-22 03:43:40 UTC

เฒ _เฒ 

2018-10-22 03:44:39 UTC

Look. I'm Jewish. A friend of mine told me a joke about the holocaust and I found it funny. Dark humor is a thing. It doesn't mean I'm anti-Semitic.

2018-10-22 03:44:55 UTC

Oh, that's literally D20

2018-10-22 03:45:32 UTC

Also the confidence threshold for "statistically significant" in social sciences

2018-10-22 03:45:49 UTC

(95%)

2018-10-22 03:46:23 UTC

The joke was literally along the lines of an MMO and Jews dropping epic loot. The person who said it was also Jewish.

2018-10-22 03:46:31 UTC

Nonsense, Shallan. As a Jew myself, I can 100% confirm that telling a single dark joke instantly turned me into a white supremacist. So I don't know what you're talking about

2018-10-22 03:47:11 UTC

I don't even need to go into that direction

2018-10-22 03:47:22 UTC

It's prima facie absurd to call 5% of a sample "not uncommon"

2018-10-22 03:47:30 UTC

I swear to god triggered snowflake extreme leftists cannot be allowed to have any power. It will be the death of us all.

2018-10-22 03:47:41 UTC

At least if you're also bot willing to basically throw out like all of that lauded social science

2018-10-22 03:49:01 UTC

I like to think it will lead to a Secret Commune of the Sane.

2018-10-22 03:49:16 UTC

We can write each other optimistic pamphlets with sketchy humour

2018-10-22 03:49:42 UTC

There's a reason why the NPC meme is still funny

2018-10-22 03:49:45 UTC

There's a reason why the NPC meme is still funny

2018-10-22 03:49:47 UTC

Meet under rainy streetlamps at four am to discuss economics sensibly

2018-10-22 03:50:25 UTC

Compose popular tunes with subtly sarcastic messages

2018-10-22 03:50:43 UTC

```
๐Ÿ…ฑarD 2017-03-08 03:07:43

Purge all non-whites from every possible Universe.

Chancellor 2017-03-08 03:08:06

What if we're not white enough for another universe?```

2018-10-22 03:52:20 UTC

I also like how the supposed condemnation of Sargon is...some of them discussing how Sargon's centrism is possibly bad for the far right

2018-10-22 03:52:45 UTC

```
Insomnant 2017-03-08 02:47:08

My point is that the moderate left won't join us, ever. The moderate right might though. If the guy they have entertaining them is a centrist, the moderate right will stick with him. If they only have a left-wing guy entertaining them they might wind up coming to us

๐Ÿ…ฑarD 2017-03-08 02:48:07

I was moderate right and I have been going more and more right. If it came to a right vs left war I would choose the right over left or neutral. And I kindof follow Sargon and other centrist.

Insomnant 2017-03-08 02:48:46

But the point is that by removing the central option, the choices become 'left' or 'right.' And anyone disgusted by the left, has to go right```

2018-10-22 03:54:07 UTC

So, three facts
1) Some fascists like Sargon
2) Some fascists think he's an impediment
3) Both in this discussion agree he is a centrist

2018-10-22 14:34:45 UTC

P.S.A this picture is being shared around again in association with the incoming caravan from Honduras. Itโ€™s a picture from a fat fetish porn website, not someone in the caravan . See here yourself https://www.tineye.com/search/65f754f95d559c629c41ef14de07d93ec1770b6e/

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/499941445063671809/503938618923024406/image0.png

2018-10-22 16:39:37 UTC

@velvitonator `An online community develops its own lingo over time. Among fascist activists โ€œred-pillingโ€ means converting someone to fascist, racist and anti-Semitic beliefs.`

2018-10-22 16:40:23 UTC

Who knew?

2018-10-22 16:40:32 UTC

Oh wait no one did because it's not true.

2018-10-22 16:42:51 UTC

it is true when you factor in the meaning of those words based off the context from how they use them

2018-10-22 16:43:21 UTC

so replace fascist and racist with "not leftist"

2018-10-22 16:44:21 UTC

I'm on the fucking left, I'm not a crazy.

2018-10-22 16:54:36 UTC

leftist

2018-10-22 16:54:40 UTC

regressive

2018-10-22 18:46:54 UTC

Same thing, fucking crazies.

2018-10-22 18:49:53 UTC

fascist are most red pilled.

2018-10-22 18:50:27 UTC

Fascist live in an entirely different blue pill fantasy.

2018-10-22 18:52:10 UTC

i dont know what kind of fascist you have encountered...
but we need fascism to clean up current mess.

2018-10-22 19:03:35 UTC

Fascism doesn't clean up anything, it just causes more problems. The only failure of state worse than Fascism is communism, but that's only because it takes longer to fail and causes more suffering because of it.

2018-10-22 19:10:28 UTC

I just saw this on facebook.

2018-10-22 19:10:39 UTC

this is a perfect example of fake news right here

2018-10-22 19:11:22 UTC

Yes they opposed a vote to abolish the death penalty not just the death penalty for being gay...

2018-10-22 19:11:59 UTC

I think you would like this @Timcast

2018-10-22 20:45:08 UTC

@Dennafen how does facism cause problems?
historically it have worked really well.
and what suffering?

2018-10-22 20:49:11 UTC

The only real failed Facist regimes were Nazi Germany and Italy - Spain was relatively stable for decades, same with many South American Facist states until overthrown by a world power.

2018-10-22 20:49:45 UTC

Longest Time Egypt and Turkey were facist and were extrmely secular, safe, and stable

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